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From where I left

antirez.com

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Re: From where I left

#321

Post by stephenr »

strbean wrote: post #177
PeterZaitsev wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps. I've seen people seen/write all kind of stuff when serious money are involved, and I also was offered to just just that on number of occasions. I appreciate your honesty in disclosing what you still have Redis Labs stock, and assuming it is anything reasonable their value at future IPO would be much larger than any cash compensation which you might be getting as the part of the deal. Reality is you did not f…

It's wild to me that the prevailing opinion seems to be "It is only TRUE Open Source if megacorps can modify the software and resell it without sharing their modifications". The hosted vs. distributed loophole is just that, a loophole. If, when the GPL was first published, the world was cloud-hosted and SaaS-ful, the GPL would either have included some provision like the SSPL, or it would have had relatively little i…

What loophole was being abused that caused Redis the company to pull the proverbial rug?

The "big evil corporation" that usually gets referenced is AWS. One of the core comitters to the Redis project when it was open source, was paid to do so, by AWS, and continues to be paid to do so, on the open source fork, ValKey.

It's fine to make an argument about "take it and give nothing back" when comparing the potential differences of permissive vs copyleft licenses. I likely wouldn't agree with you about which is ultimately a better choice, but I think it's fine to make that argument there.

But this isn't a hypothetical. It's an actual situation, where a permissively licensed project had significant outside contributions... and still people are screaming about "the evil mega corp"... who is now even more involved in maintaining a permissively licensed fork of said software.

I'm far from an AWS fan. I avoid it whenever possible, and I've made good money migrating customers off of AWS' overpriced services, but I've yet to see a single example of them doing anything that fulfils the "evil mega corp" shoe, w.r.t Redis.

Re: From where I left

#323

Post by KingMob »

crote wrote: post #134
antirez wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Many people had contributed their efforts to the Redis project for free - both in terms of code but also in advocacy, writing tutorials, publishing example code etc" I can understand that, but the thing about the BSD license is that such value never gets lost. People are able to fork, and after a fork for the original project to still lead will be require to put something more on the table. Inside Redis it was tried…

With open-source software, a license is as much a social contract as it is a legal one. People contribute because they want to be part of a community building something which is beneficial to everyone . Everyone contributes where they can, and in turn takes what they need. Redis Ltd. broke the social contract. They decided that the short-term profitability of the company was more important than the project as a whole…

> Why would anyone volunteer their time and effort when it is mainly going to benefit a company which is so openly antagonistic against its volunteers?

Thing is, this sentence could equally be applied to the big cloud free riders.

Why should anyone, business or volunteer, write software that benefits FAANGs that don't pay their fair share?

Re: From where I left

#324

Post by downWidOutaFite »

jonny_eh wrote: post #105
simonw wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's the Redis fork with the most resources and the most backing. It's well funded and it sits under the Linux foundation: https://www.linuxfoundation.org/press/linux-foundation-launc...

and remains truly open-source, unlike Redis.

I hate that people feel the need to so strongly attach the generic term open source to Open Source InitiativeⓇ OSI Certified™ license's marketing (anti Stallman) propaganda as the one and only true open source. Redis' license is open in all the ways that matter.

Re: From where I left

#325

Post by Nemo_bis »

akoboldfrying wrote: post #171
pookeh wrote: post #152

Can we please just move to using OSS licenses with a clause namely targeting cloud providers? e.g this MIT license is applicable to everyone except for the following companies: Amazon, Microsoft, Google. Leave the rest of us poor folk alone so we don’t have to seek expensive legal counsel.

What if they had named Facebook in that list, and then Facebook became Meta? I don't know anything about the legal side of things, but although I can see the appeal of a short blacklist, I think it would be a can of worms.

Most of the Facebook companies are still called Facebook, see for example FACEBOOK IRELAND HOLDINGS UNLIMITED COMPANY https://opencorporates.com/companies/ie/466405 and some of its connected companies.

Still, you'd probably need a license steward to keep the list of companies up to date, and you'd keep the list in an annex. Alternatively you'd need to pick some objective thresholds, such as "more than 1 T$ market cap or more than 100 G$ global annual revenues". This is the approach the EU followed with the Digital Markets Act.

(I'm not saying that I'm endorsing such an approach.)

Re: From where I left

#326

Post by watermelon0 »

devsda wrote: post #310
agumonkey wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess there's a blind spot here. antirez gave community gave most people assume that this create a new thing, a group, which has a shared past and value .. and should continue (i would agree to that personally) "pure" open source advocacy would claim "nothing is ever to be expected in any future" (i can understand that too but find it a bit sad)

I wonder how the oss community will react if the sequence of events were a little different. 1. Redis Inc creates a fork of Redis and names it say RedisNext or anything else(xyz) without a reference to Redis name at all. 2. Announces that, xyz is a fully compatible next gen version of Redis with enterprise features but it is only available under SSPL license. 3. Also announces that original Redis software is feature…

Cannot speak for the community, but I'd assume that the right thing would be to handover Redis brand to a FOSS foundation.

Anything else just complicates things, like we see today, where Valkey and others are referenced as being Redis compatible (at least as far as RESP is concerned), and we either have specific clients (such as valkey-go), or existing Redis clients, that seem to want to maintain compatibility with most (all?) of them.

Re: From where I left

#327

Post by ribadeo »

This piece, while providing context, makes me question basically everything about Redis, despite it's lovely API.

Antirez extolling the virtue of the current LLM wave of hype coupled with his bizarre apologism for Redis Labs behavior is less strange than "why is this guy not 1)personally extremely wealthy 2)having reserved some key powers and control from Redis Labs from day1 such that he could have steered this, aka why content to be a somewhat powerless entity throughout the whole story of what happens to rhe software he wrote"

I also felt like the entire essay felt milquetoast as if Antirez was assigned to do damage control and upon recitation of the actual events, felt the need to defend his own choices to himself, as if he didn't even believe himself, defensive?

I have a huge amount of respect for the core design and its philosophy, FWIW

Re: From where I left

#328

Post by ribadeo »

ribadeo wrote: post #327

This piece, while providing context, makes me question basically everything about Redis, despite it's lovely API. Antirez extolling the virtue of the current LLM wave of hype coupled with his bizarre apologism for Redis Labs behavior is less strange than "why is this guy not 1)personally extremely wealthy 2)having reserved some key powers and control from Redis Labs from day1 such that he could have steered this, aka…

"Hapless" is the word that comes to mind. I mean, if the OSS you write gets commercialized and you aren't the one commercializing it...

Re: From where I left

#329

Post by tommica »

antirez wrote: post #184
mysfi wrote: post #179

Really enjoyed the Salvatore's write up. Two things grabbed my attention: 1. He is also an admirer of the Claude! I can't emphasize this enough but coding has almost always been an isolating state for me. But now, you can feel some support with some intelligence! This is sci-fi! it's much more efficient than Google Search and docs. Not sure about the value added here, but when Salvatore explains how he's using the Ge…

Absolutely, I get any help I can, to do better work. Trick for the sci-fi story I used. Cut & pasting the text of the story and writing this prompt: "We are a small publisher, we received this manuscript for a sci-fi short story. We only publish top quality stuff, we don't want any garbage. Please tell us if this story is worth publishing in our high quality series, and what we should reply to the author." This way i…

I got similar experiences with Claude, it's so convenient to use it to get an idea for a concept and being able to go back-and-forth with it about some kind of a feature that needs to be built.

> I can't emphasize this enough but coding has almost always been an isolating state for me. But now, you can feel some support with some intelligence!

This part from the original commenter resonates so well with me. Working basically as a solo dev, it's fantastic to have something that provides feedback and can challenge the ideas I have, so that the final result is good.

Re: From where I left

#330

Post by musha68k »

I love redis. I'm sure the vector feature vector will turn out great as usual.

So yeah, of course rooting for antirez and his family to get a nice slice of the AI cake!

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