Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

From where I left

antirez.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

151–160 of 472 posts

Re: From where I left

#151

Post by simonw »

bsnnkv wrote: post #127
simonw wrote: post #68

For me, the license change upset me mainly for two reasons: 1. Many people had contributed their efforts to the Redis project for free - both in terms of code but also in advocacy, writing tutorials, publishing example code etc - and when they did that it was under the understanding that project would remain under the same open source license. It honestly felt like a betrayal of trust. 2. From a purely selfish point…

> I do also see these kinds of license trends as harmful to open source generally I've re-read this a few times and I'm still not sure what "harmful to open source" means in this sentence, could you expand on this a bit when you have time? (readings I considered: this will dissuade people from using OSI licenses, this will dissuade people from trying to monetize open source components, this will dissuade people from…

I see the open source movement as being about developers sharing their work in order to raise all ships and dramatically accelerate the rate at which participants in that community can build cool software.

A lot of that benefit comes from not having to worry about licenses: pick platform components with known open source licenses, build cool things with them.

I think the rise in not-quite-open-source licenses (especially projects switching to those licenses) undermines the things that I value about open source, and further encourages more projects to make those decisions in the future.

Re: From where I left

#152

Post by pookeh »

Can we please just move to using OSS licenses with a clause namely targeting cloud providers? e.g this MIT license is applicable to everyone except for the following companies: Amazon, Microsoft, Google.

Leave the rest of us poor folk alone so we don’t have to seek expensive legal counsel.

Re: From where I left

#153

Post by tluyben2 »

antirez wrote: post #35
anonzzzies wrote: post #32

I am a big fan your work, including your lua c64 coding thing which actually was a great educational tool for my small cousins and for some friends. Also works well on the go. Just wanted to say that.

I appreciated a lot reading your comment. I feel silly sometimes when I use months of time to write something like LOAD81, I question my sanity, but then I see that other people had some good time with it and I'm so happy: and also I'm sure that I used my time in the best way.

I for one partially wrote a few mobile games with LOAD81 ; I was travelling and only had my Pandora with me; I wrote all the logic tested them all out with load81. Of course I had to actually get them on a mobile platform device and create a better UI, however all the logic and most of the UX was all done in lua on load81.

Re: From where I left

#154

Post by PeterZaitsev »

simonw wrote: post #101
antirez wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Many people had contributed their efforts to the Redis project for free - both in terms of code but also in advocacy, writing tutorials, publishing example code etc" I can understand that, but the thing about the BSD license is that such value never gets lost. People are able to fork, and after a fork for the original project to still lead will be require to put something more on the table. Inside Redis it was tried…

I'm embarrassed to admit that I hadn't fully taken into account that those contributions do at least remain under the BSD license and hence stay open under those original terms. Thanks for reminding me of that.

Note though, the code is not Music, it rots quickly without maintenance. The "social contract" of contributing the code is what it will be maintained by collective community, otherwise many companies would just keep it as private forks.

It is wonderful thing though, with Open Source, people can band together and "pull Valkey" to create well maintained fork based on all those past contributions

Re: From where I left

#155

Post by jart »

crote wrote: post #134
antirez wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Many people had contributed their efforts to the Redis project for free - both in terms of code but also in advocacy, writing tutorials, publishing example code etc" I can understand that, but the thing about the BSD license is that such value never gets lost. People are able to fork, and after a fork for the original project to still lead will be require to put something more on the table. Inside Redis it was tried…

With open-source software, a license is as much a social contract as it is a legal one. People contribute because they want to be part of a community building something which is beneficial to everyone . Everyone contributes where they can, and in turn takes what they need. Redis Ltd. broke the social contract. They decided that the short-term profitability of the company was more important than the project as a whole…

Open source is a gift economy. Receiving a gift does not form a social contract that entitles you to future gifts. It is not a "rug pull" for someone to stop giving you gifts. The old versions of Redis are yours for all time. No one can take that away from you. In fact, Redis is still giving you gifts to this day, just with a different wrapping. The new license seems perfectly reasonable, given how much companies like Amazon have exploited the gift economy to the point where it threatens these startups survival.

Re: From where I left

#156

Post by forty »

pookeh wrote: post #152

Can we please just move to using OSS licenses with a clause namely targeting cloud providers? e.g this MIT license is applicable to everyone except for the following companies: Amazon, Microsoft, Google. Leave the rest of us poor folk alone so we don’t have to seek expensive legal counsel.

I think the right solution for this problem, and many others, is not to allow the "platform" to compete inside their own garden.

So if you offer infrastructure, you cannot offer managed DBs there, if you have a market place you cannot sell on it, if you have an app store, you cannot sell apps there. Etc etc

Re: From where I left

#157

Post by jeffchuber »

antirez wrote: post #13
rcarmo wrote: post #5

Well, I see this as great news. I've been tinkering with vector search myself and really don't like the APIs, query structures, even the embedding steps required. Anything that makes it simpler (and faster) is most welcome. I do hope Salvatore keeps doing emulators for MCUs, though :)

Thank you Rui, my target is: API that can be learned and used under 120 seconds. I don't think more of this is needed, for the basic usage. Then there could be other stuff, but it must be incremental. Easy things must be easy.

chroma's api i think takes something like 20 seconds

Re: From where I left

#158

Post by inopinatus »

bsnnkv wrote: post #127
simonw wrote: post #68

For me, the license change upset me mainly for two reasons: 1. Many people had contributed their efforts to the Redis project for free - both in terms of code but also in advocacy, writing tutorials, publishing example code etc - and when they did that it was under the understanding that project would remain under the same open source license. It honestly felt like a betrayal of trust. 2. From a purely selfish point…

> I do also see these kinds of license trends as harmful to open source generally I've re-read this a few times and I'm still not sure what "harmful to open source" means in this sentence, could you expand on this a bit when you have time? (readings I considered: this will dissuade people from using OSI licenses, this will dissuade people from trying to monetize open source components, this will dissuade people from…

In this matter, that pretty phrase “social contract” is at root a demand for ego massage from a) contributors that don’t actually believe in the freewheeling spirit of the BSD/MIT licenses but used it anyway, and b) noncontributors whose sense of entitlement is projecting as loss aversion.

The revised license is nevertheless a problem for component selection. Usage caveats are a landmine and thereby a coherent motivation for the Valkey fork.

Re: From where I left

#159

Post by bhouston »

rubiquity wrote: post #145
bhouston wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I believe there is a single person that was in Redis and works there now, at least AFAIK. And this person stopped working at Redis long time ago (and was not a core developer). It is probably more correct to say a bunch of Redis contributors left the Redis GitHub project and moved over to Valkey. You can see there are a bunch of contributors listed on this page who seem to predate the fork and who have continued to…

Nearly all of them work at cloud providers so they literally just followed their income stream.

> Nearly all of them work at cloud providers so they literally just followed their income stream.

Sure. And same for Redis employees who continue to work on the Redis Github project. All my significant contributions to open source have had financial incentives as well.

Re: From where I left

#160

Post by seqizz »

I think people are not afraid of the current change on licensing, but the magic is broken as soon as a company starts wandering around. Yes the current license is not that bad, but while we have valkey on the side now, how can I trust "Redis Inc." will not decide another small change which does not affect me, then the next one, until it makes something which does affect me.
Post reply on HN