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How Blackjack Works (2007)

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Re: How Blackjack Works (2007)

#21

Post by 486sx33 »

ProjectArcturis wrote: post #15
imglorp wrote: post #2

Is card counting still possible, or have casinos implemented enough countermeasures to defeat its advantage?

Here's my story about counting blackjack successfully. It takes place in 2014, at the now-demolished Riviera. At the time, the Riviera was pretty run-down, definitely one of the cheapest places on the Strip. I was in Vegas for the first and only time. They had single-deck blackjack that had a unique side bet. Basically you could make additional bets that you would get dealt a natural blackjack, with a couple variatio…

Loved the Riv, I was there at a very similar time as you I think. I liked the steps when you walked in, and all the places they shot Casino at. I saw a cool show in the theater which is also shown in Casino. I guess I’m more a movie guy than a casino guy, but I love Vegas. The food court was absolutely run down and awful and we lost at roulette, but I don’t bet large. Hats off to you for having a good counting game. I play blackjack like a sucker but I usually do OK.

Re: How Blackjack Works (2007)

#22

Post by johnwatson11218 »

There was a documentary on Prime Video a couple of years ago that followed a card counter as he moved from casino to casino living out of his RV. I think he was up around $600K after one year. He was having to get kicked out of small casinos all over the place and keep moving to new ones every few days. At one point he tells the camera crew that he has to start driving 1/2 a day to skip over a few spots to stay ahead of the surveillance. It didn't look easy but not impossible. He got to set his own hours and be his own boss.

Re: How Blackjack Works (2007)

#23

Post by grigri907 »

bagels wrote: post #17
pwython wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting. Why would a dealer care if someone is winning? Usually big winners tip the dealer handsomely.

Dealers care because the casino cares, and pays them to care.

Having never been to a casino, I've always wondered, on what grounds will a casino ask you to leave? Just that it's private property and they no longer want to serve you? It makes it pretty transparent that the house always wins, and even when they don't they can ask you to leave, ensuring they always win.

I love the implication when someone is asked to leave but, "the rest of you, you losers can stay."

Re: How Blackjack Works (2007)

#24

Post by hsbauauvhabzb »

onekorg wrote: post #12
imglorp wrote: post #2

Is card counting still possible, or have casinos implemented enough countermeasures to defeat its advantage?

Advantage play in Black Jack boils down to: 1. Placing minimum bets when odds are in the casino's favor. 2. Placing large bets when odds are in the player's favor. This makes the betting patterns of solo counters very different and easily identifiable from average joes. Some players do try to add some variance and make intentional non-optimal plays to avoid detection. But every non-optimal play costs money and doing…

Is it theoretically possible to beat the casino edge in either scenario?

Re: How Blackjack Works (2007)

#25

Post by asdfasvea »

imglorp wrote: post #2

Is card counting still possible, or have casinos implemented enough countermeasures to defeat its advantage?

I haven't seen a beatable game in 10 years.

Less and less single and double deck tables, dealers placing the cut card nearer the middle of the shoe, more restrictions on doubling down and they changed blackjack to pay 6 to 5 instead of 3 to 2.

Re: How Blackjack Works (2007)

#26

Post by splonk »

grigri907 wrote: post #23
bagels wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dealers care because the casino cares, and pays them to care.

Having never been to a casino, I've always wondered, on what grounds will a casino ask you to leave? Just that it's private property and they no longer want to serve you? It makes it pretty transparent that the house always wins, and even when they don't they can ask you to leave, ensuring they always win. I love the implication when someone is asked to leave but, "the rest of you, you losers can stay."

The casino has no problem just telling you, "you're too good for us". Depending on the situation and the mood of everyone involved, you may be told you're welcome to play other games, or you might just get trespassed.

Note that due to a New Jersey court ruling, casinos in Atlantic City actually can't bar people for counting cards. In general the game conditions there are worse to make up for that.

Re: How Blackjack Works (2007)

#27

Post by lambda »

hsbauauvhabzb wrote: post #24
onekorg wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Advantage play in Black Jack boils down to: 1. Placing minimum bets when odds are in the casino's favor. 2. Placing large bets when odds are in the player's favor. This makes the betting patterns of solo counters very different and easily identifiable from average joes. Some players do try to add some variance and make intentional non-optimal plays to avoid detection. But every non-optimal play costs money and doing…

Is it theoretically possible to beat the casino edge in either scenario?

Yes. It is. And if the casino realizes that you're doing it, you'll be banned from the casino.

So most people who do this come up with clever ways to continue to do so while being less easy to detect, like having multiple people work together. One person stays at the table, betting at a fairly constant rate, while signaling to a partner when the odds are in the players favor so the partner joins the table and places big bets.

The thing is, this all takes a good amount of work and effort, requires a sufficient bankroll to begin with so you don't just have a small run if bad luck and run out of money, and does have some risk of gambler's ruin or just getting detected by the casino and banned.

At some point, it's just a risky investment combined with a job. And you can probably do better by just starting a company or investing your money and getting a job.

Re: How Blackjack Works (2007)

#28

Post by TylerE »

grigri907 wrote: post #23
bagels wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dealers care because the casino cares, and pays them to care.

Having never been to a casino, I've always wondered, on what grounds will a casino ask you to leave? Just that it's private property and they no longer want to serve you? It makes it pretty transparent that the house always wins, and even when they don't they can ask you to leave, ensuring they always win. I love the implication when someone is asked to leave but, "the rest of you, you losers can stay."

Typically they won’t actually ban you? Just flat net you (ie if playing must bet the same each hand)

Re: How Blackjack Works (2007)

#29

Post by monero-xmr »

johnwatson11218 wrote: post #22

There was a documentary on Prime Video a couple of years ago that followed a card counter as he moved from casino to casino living out of his RV. I think he was up around $600K after one year. He was having to get kicked out of small casinos all over the place and keep moving to new ones every few days. At one point he tells the camera crew that he has to start driving 1/2 a day to skip over a few spots to stay ahead…

There is an entire niche of casino streamers (see kick.com). They basically get free chips and can more / less keep their winnings, but the real money is in all the referrals from people who watch them, which are likely the highest paid referrals on the entire internet given the value of each user. Much easier to earn a living gambling-as-entertainment than gambling-to-win

Re: How Blackjack Works (2007)

#30

Post by ianhawes »

TylerE wrote: post #28
grigri907 wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having never been to a casino, I've always wondered, on what grounds will a casino ask you to leave? Just that it's private property and they no longer want to serve you? It makes it pretty transparent that the house always wins, and even when they don't they can ask you to leave, ensuring they always win. I love the implication when someone is asked to leave but, "the rest of you, you losers can stay."

Typically they won’t actually ban you? Just flat net you (ie if playing must bet the same each hand)

They may also just ban you from playing blackjack and warn you that if you're caught at the blackjack table again you're trespassed.
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