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Senators say TSA's facial recognition program is out of control

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Re: Senators say TSA's facial recognition program is out of control

#221

Post by 1659447091 »

_yb2s wrote: post #36
blackeyeblitzar wrote: post #2

I was shocked to see this program arrive in my local airport. I opt out every time, but the horrifying thing is that almost everyone simply complies with whatever is asked of them. The TSA agents use phrasing that make it seem like you are supposed to go through the facial recognition process and don’t have a choice. Yes, there are tiny signs scattered around that say you can opt out. But when the officer says “step…

TSA will punish you for opting out of anything. If you're lucky, the least they will do is hold you up a long time so you have a good chance of missing your flight. I've also had them sexually harass me, and confiscate (e.g. steal) legal items in retaliation for opting out of things I had the legal right to opt out of. They know people are in a hurry and won't do anything about being treated unethically or illegally,…

I would be curious to know which airport(s) you receive this treatment from? I fly regularly between a handful of major US hubs. There is only one airport that I would be vocal about their treatment of passengers to a group of local TSA that I played co-ed sports with. The most senior one's response was that it wasn't surprising as that location (entire airport management) has had a toxic culture from the top down and they were trying to clean it up but it's still a bureaucracy. Anywhere else and I have an agent that would be having an off or bad day, but nothing like what you are describing at any of the others.

When I pull the pre-check random scanner check, I opt out and will go straight into small talk with the agent, they don't like it any more than you do, (maybe one or two might) but the majority they want it over with as quickly as you do. My personal tactic is to go into my story of being sexually molested at a checkpoint at an airport in Spain. It was very unexpected and extremely uncomfortable, including the smile after as though waiting for me to drop my number. I can joke about it now, and it gives TSA agents an opening to assure me that is not their intent without being weird about it. They're also annoyed that people who do things like that give them all a bad rep

Re: Senators say TSA's facial recognition program is out of control

#222

Post by throw3828374 »

southernplaces7 wrote: post #203
tehjoker wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

tbqh, first if the insinuation is that China is not democratic, that is only true in the sense it is not a liberal democracy with a conservative wing represented (a good thing), but it is still a democracy with elections. secondly, if people surviving a literal genocide in Palestine can resist the most technologically sophisticated, surveilled, and completely enclosed death camp ever constructed by the U.S. and Israe…

It's sometimes hard to credit that there are people who think in such a contorted way as you apparently do. China isn't a democracy. The word doesn't apply when your choices for candidates can only come from one political party that pre-approved them. Don't be absurd. It's a one-party state in which variations of style among different senior figures are still forced together under the rubric of a general monolithic d…

OP brings up a good point.

The news likes to allude to China's "genocide" in Xinjiang, but no one is dying.

At most they can stretch it to a "cultural genocide" but even that's not true as the native culture is not being repressed, only religious extremism.

However it is true that thousands of Palestinian civilians are being killed and those same media are afraid to call it out.

Re: Senators say TSA's facial recognition program is out of control

#223

Post by yownie »

godelski wrote: post #199
bilekas wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But the upside is that it’s the oldest country in the world if you measure by (codified) constitution. Iceland would very much like a word about this. But your point in fair, maybe phrased a bit wrong.

>> Please correct me but cite so I can learn more Wiki says > The current constitution was first instituted on 17 June 1944 when Iceland became a republic; since then, it has been amended seven times. The earliest date I even see in the wiki is 1849 which isn't even really on topic. The official document also says 1944[0] CONSTITUTION OF THE REPUBLIC OF ICELAND (No. 33, 17 June 1944, as amended 30 May 1984, 31 May 19…

he is speaking of our [Alþingi](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Althing) which has existed since 930.

Re: Senators say TSA's facial recognition program is out of control

#224

Post by southernplaces7 »

throw3828374 wrote: post #222
southernplaces7 wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's sometimes hard to credit that there are people who think in such a contorted way as you apparently do. China isn't a democracy. The word doesn't apply when your choices for candidates can only come from one political party that pre-approved them. Don't be absurd. It's a one-party state in which variations of style among different senior figures are still forced together under the rubric of a general monolithic d…

OP brings up a good point. The news likes to allude to China's "genocide" in Xinjiang, but no one is dying. At most they can stretch it to a "cultural genocide" but even that's not true as the native culture is not being repressed, only religious extremism. However it is true that thousands of Palestinian civilians are being killed and those same media are afraid to call it out.

Your point is a good one actually, and it's why I didn't mention anything about genocide in Xinjiang. It's a grotesque political atrocity of social repression and culture eradication, but as far as any sources I've looked at go, the Chinese state isn't literally killing the Uyghers en masse as an ethnic or religious group.

Nonetheless, the deaths of civilians in the Gaza Strip also aren't a genocide. They could be defined as a war crime, or if you want to be really generous to Israel, as unfair collateral damage (a phrase I mostly detest in this context) but the Israeli state isn't deliberately targeting the Strip's ethnic Palestinian population for eradication.

Re: Senators say TSA's facial recognition program is out of control

#225

Post by reddotchaser »

X-Istence wrote: post #217
DanHulton wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fingerprints? I haven't ever had that happen. Perhaps only certain countries?

I am a US resident alien (green card holder) and I have my fingerprints and picture taken each time I enter the United States.

Yeah all non-citizens have to do that. If and when you become a citizen you won’t have to. It’s crazy how much nicer entering the country feels after that lol

Re: Senators say TSA's facial recognition program is out of control

#226

Post by aguaviva »

southernplaces7 wrote: post #224
throw3828374 wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OP brings up a good point. The news likes to allude to China's "genocide" in Xinjiang, but no one is dying. At most they can stretch it to a "cultural genocide" but even that's not true as the native culture is not being repressed, only religious extremism. However it is true that thousands of Palestinian civilians are being killed and those same media are afraid to call it out.

Your point is a good one actually, and it's why I didn't mention anything about genocide in Xinjiang. It's a grotesque political atrocity of social repression and culture eradication, but as far as any sources I've looked at go, the Chinese state isn't literally killing the Uyghers en masse as an ethnic or religious group. Nonetheless, the deaths of civilians in the Gaza Strip also aren't a genocide. They could be de…

The Israeli state isn't deliberately targeting the Strip's ethnic Palestinian population for eradication.

Total eradication, no.

It just wants to see it the resident population vastly reduced. And what it is deliberately doing is creating conditions favorable to this outcome, which it refers to as "voluntary transfer":

https://www.972mag.com/intelligence-ministry-gaza-population...

Re: Senators say TSA's facial recognition program is out of control

#227

Post by godelski »

MarkMarine wrote: post #218
godelski wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the last thing I want to deal with is making a protest at the checkpoint before I can get to the lounge. Remember from the article >> TSA Administrator David Pekoske in 2023 in which he said “we will get to the point where we require biometrics across the board.” An important thing to remember is that power is exponentially more difficult to roll back than it is to give out. The danger is that power creeps and you…

I'm not trying to advocate for apathy, I am happy there are people (like you) that are willing to have this fight, willing to sacrifice their time and risk being punished by the state for this.

Thank you. But I hope you can see how your first comment discourages others to

Re: Senators say TSA's facial recognition program is out of control

#228

Post by rightbyte »

godelski wrote: post #136
casenmgreen wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is that by this it becomes ever more difficult to get rid of an oppressive, dictatorial, unelected and violent Government.

For people unfamiliar with this topic, it is commonly referred to as "Turnkey Tyranny". It is about the belief that you "don't give Mr Rogers any power you wouldn't give to Hitler." Basically no matter how great you think your current leader is, you recognize that they will not be in power forever (or that they may not be good forever). Democracy, autocracy, oligarchy, whatever your system of government, there is a s…

> "Turnkey Tyranny"

Thanks this is a really great concept. I'm going to use this for the slippery slope fallacy fallacy.

Re: Senators say TSA's facial recognition program is out of control

#229

Post by MarkMarine »

godelski wrote: post #227
MarkMarine wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not trying to advocate for apathy, I am happy there are people (like you) that are willing to have this fight, willing to sacrifice their time and risk being punished by the state for this.

Thank you. But I hope you can see how your first comment discourages others to

You're right about that, if I could edit it I would

Re: Senators say TSA's facial recognition program is out of control

#230

Post by godelski »

MarkMarine wrote: post #229
godelski wrote: post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you. But I hope you can see how your first comment discourages others to

You're right about that, if I could edit it I would

No worries. We all make mistakes and we all need pushback. While we disagree on what actions we should take, I still appreciate that you've expressed yours. I want to make sure that no one ever prevents you from doing so.
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