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Meta Fined $843M by EU over Marketplace Ads

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Re: Meta Fined $843M by EU over Marketplace Ads

#51

Post by tossandthrow »

ahmeneeroe-v2 wrote: post #42
tossandthrow wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is politics. The US act exactly the same way against EU companies: https://www.pharmavoice.com/news/ftc-request-novo-catalent-d...

That's kind of my point. This isn't "consumer protection", it's a shakedown of a US company by the EU. I think that the incoming US administration will seek to play politics more aggressively than the current admin.

Probably - or at least that is the rhetorics.

However, it is not clear that this is not in balance already. The discussion thread seems to believe that the EU is being harsher to the US than the other way around.

Re: Meta Fined $843M by EU over Marketplace Ads

#52

Post by mdhb »

aurareturn wrote: post #44
doublerabbit wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> taxation on big American tech companies And that's a bad thing how?

It depends. Is the EU presenting itself as a bastion of free trade? I don't think so anymore. They're clearly protectionists with the recent actions against American big tech and Chinese EV companies.

I’d respectfully put it to you that you don’t seem to actually understand how any of this works. You picked two examples that have nothing to do with the accusation of “protectionism”.

Re: Meta Fined $843M by EU over Marketplace Ads

#54

Post by olliebrkr »

dgroshev wrote: post #41

I suspect the latter part is so commonplace that many technologists don't even think twice about it. > Unilaterally imposing unfair trading conditions on other online classified ads service providers who advertise on Meta's platforms, in particular on its very popular social networks Facebook and Instagram. This allows Meta to use ads-related data generated by other advertisers for the sole benefit of Facebook Market…

It's 100% predatory. I hope we will see similar cases brought against Amazon soon (if they haven't been already).

The fact that so many companies are dependent on selling on Amazon, yet Amazon also sells their own products, is ludicrous.

- AcmeShop sells 3d printers and sell on Amazon

- Amazon sees these printers are selling well

- Amazon buys/creates their own 3d printer brand

- Amazon gives their own products preferencial treatment and uses all it's data for how AcmeShop's printers are selling to undercut them in all markets

- AcmeShop goes out of business because unaware consumers buy what, on the surface, is a better deal

- With no competition Amazon increases it's prices to whatever it likes

Re: Meta Fined $843M by EU over Marketplace Ads

#55

Post by crazygringo »

dgroshev wrote: post #41

I suspect the latter part is so commonplace that many technologists don't even think twice about it. > Unilaterally imposing unfair trading conditions on other online classified ads service providers who advertise on Meta's platforms, in particular on its very popular social networks Facebook and Instagram. This allows Meta to use ads-related data generated by other advertisers for the sole benefit of Facebook Market…

Can you clarify the abusive part?

In your scenario, Alice already decided not to buy anything from AcmeShop.

Even if AcmeShop advertised on Facebook it wouldn't have changed her behavior. She got a better deal on Facebook Marketplace. And she was already visiting Facebook and the Marketplace is already a single click.

I don't see the abusive or predatory part. It seems like Facebook Marketplace just offered a superior used 3D printer for her.

So what part am I missing?

Re: Meta Fined $843M by EU over Marketplace Ads

#56

Post by philjohn »

threeseed wrote: post #47
Etheryte wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This isn't even remotely what happened here. Similar to the case where Apple was fined, Meta had years to comply with the new regulations — they simply chose not to and put their fingers in their ears instead. It's naive to think Meta didn't know it was breaking the law, they simply hoped they could get away with a fine that was smaller than the profit made.

> Meta had years to comply with the new regulations This has nothing to do with the DMA if that's what you mean. EU is alleging Meta is infringing on the 1994 EEA Agreement specifically the generic "don't impose unfair trading conditions" clause. Which if it successful should frighten most companies. Because making life harder for your competitors is the entire point of business.

If Zuck is to be believed, he's not about making life harder for competitors, he's about competing vigorously.

If you leverage your business, and data obtained for other reasons, to unfairly depress competition, the end user loses out, and is part of why antitrust legislation exists.

Another example is what Amazon were accused of - using their internal data from providing seller services to then decide which products to launch in their Amazon Basics range - to the point where it makes those other products no longer profitable to sell, and an option for consumers is removed.

If they conducted research without using that data about what products people would like, that's different - that's competing vigorously and fairly.

Re: Meta Fined $843M by EU over Marketplace Ads

#57

Post by diogofranco »

olliebrkr wrote: post #45

It surprises me how many people here are against this decision, and expressing sentiment that this is bad for the EU tech scene. Meta has been fined because they employed tactics to undermine competition and persistently employ anti-competitive tactics. Why is it wrong for the EU to force companies to obey it's laws and act in the best interest of it's inhabitants? The companies being targeted are some of the biggest…

Do you live in the EU? From where I stand I mostly got cookie banners, can't get to Google maps or flights from Google search, get AI launches 6 months after the rest of the world if at all etc.. Not yet feeling all the consumer benefits

Re: Meta Fined $843M by EU over Marketplace Ads

#58

Post by olliebrkr »

crazygringo wrote: post #55
dgroshev wrote: post #41

I suspect the latter part is so commonplace that many technologists don't even think twice about it. > Unilaterally imposing unfair trading conditions on other online classified ads service providers who advertise on Meta's platforms, in particular on its very popular social networks Facebook and Instagram. This allows Meta to use ads-related data generated by other advertisers for the sole benefit of Facebook Market…

Can you clarify the abusive part? In your scenario, Alice already decided not to buy anything from AcmeShop. Even if AcmeShop advertised on Facebook it wouldn't have changed her behavior. She got a better deal on Facebook Marketplace. And she was already visiting Facebook and the Marketplace is already a single click. I don't see the abusive or predatory part. It seems like Facebook Marketplace just offered a superio…

It's one sided. Facebook have all the data for how AcmeShop's products are selling. They are free to use this information to undercut AcmeShop's products with data AcmeShop does not have on Facebook.

Yes, it's a better deal on the face of it, but as soon as AcmeShop goes out of business, competition is gone and Facebook can charge whatever they want. And we all know from the US markets that low to no competition does not benefit the consumer in any way.

Re: Meta Fined $843M by EU over Marketplace Ads

#59

Post by jahabrewer »

philjohn wrote: post #49
ancorevard wrote: post #28

Will future tech companies bother making their products available in the EU? Will it be worth it, or is just too big of a risk with uncertain outcomes?

It's a large market, and more profitable than APAC and RoW per user (just look at the Meta investor presentations which show that it's US, followed by the EU then APAC and RoW[1]). [1] https://s21.q4cdn.com/399680738/files/doc_financials/2024/q3...

The slide I see says _revenue_. I think you have to consider cost of revenue too, and these EU fines affect that.

So if the EU goes to fines being "% of worldwide turnover"... do the math

Re: Meta Fined $843M by EU over Marketplace Ads

#60

Post by ouddv »

ahmeneeroe-v2 wrote: post #20

I wonder if the next administration will put a stop to this EU trade war against US Big Tech, or if they will let specific companies (e.g. Meta & Google) continue to suffer due to a (perceived or real) bias against that admin during their 2016-2020 tenure and their political campaigns. I imagine at the very least that the company formerly known as Twitter will be protected.

> I imagine at the very least that the company formerly known as Twitter will be protected.

verified: https://www.the-independent.com/news/world/americas/us-polit...

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