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Do AI detectors work? Students face false cheating accusations

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Re: Do AI detectors work? Students face false cheating accusations

#991

Post by STEPHREYMI »

skhunted wrote: post #491

I’ve been teaching in higher education for 30 years and am soon retiring. I teach math. In every math course there is massive amounts of cheating on everything that is graded that is not proctored in a classroom setting. Locking down browsers and whatnot does not prevent cheating. The only solution is to require face-to-face proctored exams and not allow students to use technology of any kind while taking the test. B…

It's insane to make a decision that you want to hire a hacker to solve a problem for you, meanwhile the hacker's you're hiring are more problems to the one you have. My past thought. But all this changed after I met dehacklord@gmail.com. May God bless you .

Re: Do AI detectors work? Students face false cheating accusations

#992

Post by lumost »

curiouscavalier wrote: post #758
_ea1k wrote: post #624

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This really can't be emphasized enough. Universities and the initial hiring process really optimize for a score and not for learning. Those could be, and sometimes are, correlated, but it isn't necessarily the case. Really focusing on stretching yourself necessarily means lower grades. Why is that penalized? TBH, in software engineering a lot of people with lower grades tutor the ones with 4.0 averages. The skillsets…

And it penalizes in many ways. Focusing too much on grades can be detrimental in graduate studies, despite graduate admissions focusing on GPA and test scores. I remember seeing 4.0 undergrads really struggle with research in grad school, sometimes to the point of dropping out. Certainly not always the case, but for the ones that did I think it speaks to your point about different skillsets. Maybe worse was seeing th…

Curiously, while I had a 2.7 in undergrad. I thrived in the workplace. The initial GPA restricted my options for the first 3-5 years, but I eventually became a Principal Engineer at a FAANG. In hindsight, I wish I had balanced my objectives more - but I also lacked the discipline to do things I didn't want to back then.

The follies of youth and all that :)

Re: Do AI detectors work? Students face false cheating accusations

#993

Post by underseacables »

borski wrote: post #29
underseacables wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Universities don't exactly decide guilt by proof. If their system says you're guilty, that's pretty much it.

Source? I was accused of a couple things (not plagiarism) at my university and was absolutely allowed to present a case, and due to a lack of evidence it was tossed and never spoken of again. So no, you don’t exactly get a trial by a jury of your peers, but it isn’t like they are averse to evidence being presented. This evidence would be fairly trivial to refute, but I agree it is a burden no student needs or wants.

University MeToo movement for one?

Re: Do AI detectors work? Students face false cheating accusations

#994

Post by sqeaky »

hnlmorg wrote: post #362
bigstrat2003 wrote: post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nobody said we shouldn't try to solve the problem. But the first step is accurately describing the problem to be solved. Something that occurs once a year across the entire country has very different solutions than something which occurs once a week in every county.

The problem is already well defined as regular school shootings. I don’t think redescribing the problem helps anyone apart from the NRA.

Yeah, sadly we already know the solution, ban or heavily restrict guns.

Every place with more guns has more shootings. It is so simple it seems almost tautological. Yet somehow this very simple fact is controversial.

Re: Do AI detectors work? Students face false cheating accusations

#995

Post by ninalanyon »

schnitzelstoat wrote: post #989
ninalanyon wrote: post #987

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When? I graduated in 1977.

I graduated in 2013, so rather later! I didn't realise the General Problems paper had such a long history!

I don't remember a paper with that name, I think it must be more recent than my time there.

Re: Do AI detectors work? Students face false cheating accusations

#996

Post by knowaveragejoe »

ndsipa_pomu wrote: post #953
knowaveragejoe wrote: post #950

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It would be a miracle if the US experienced mass shootings at the rate the UK experiences mass stabbings.

> It would be a miracle if the US experienced mass shootings at the rate the UK experiences mass stabbings. It would indeed be a miracle as the US would drastically have to reduce their number of shootings to get down to the number of UK mass stabbings. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_mass_stabbings_in_the_... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_mass_shootings_in_the_...

That is why I said that, as the comparison is pretty weak. The US' gun problem basically wouldn't be a topic of discussion if it was occurring at the rate mass stabbings do in the UK.

Re: Do AI detectors work? Students face false cheating accusations

#997

Post by strogonoff »

tonypace wrote: post #922
strogonoff wrote: post #355

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You forgot “no homework that counts, or a prison- or monastery-like environment where you have no access to any of these technologies for the length of academic term”. No, humans have not ever had a similar problem before, and also some of the solutions to various problems that we have figured out in our past are no longer considered reasonable today.

No homework that counts is essentially a double win.

See the part about “reasonable”. Let’s see how you single-handedly revolutionize school systems worldwide :)

Re: Do AI detectors work? Students face false cheating accusations

#999

Post by [deleted] »

zahlman wrote: post #617
hombre_fatal wrote: post #555

I don't understand most of the comments here. I couldn't cheat in high school because we couldn't use our phones during class. Not for worksheets nor quizzes and especially not exams whether they be multiple choice, oral, or essays. Yet the top threads here act like we need a whole refactor of schooling, many people suggesting we rely on viva voce exams and proctored exams. What exactly do you think that's solving ov…

>many people suggesting we rely on... proctored exams. What exactly do you think that's solving over a... test where the teacher ensures people aren't on their phones? That's what proctoring is.

[deleted]

Re: Do AI detectors work? Students face false cheating accusations

#1000

Post by [deleted] »

zahlman wrote: post #617
hombre_fatal wrote: post #555

I don't understand most of the comments here. I couldn't cheat in high school because we couldn't use our phones during class. Not for worksheets nor quizzes and especially not exams whether they be multiple choice, oral, or essays. Yet the top threads here act like we need a whole refactor of schooling, many people suggesting we rely on viva voce exams and proctored exams. What exactly do you think that's solving ov…

>many people suggesting we rely on... proctored exams. What exactly do you think that's solving over a... test where the teacher ensures people aren't on their phones? That's what proctoring is.

[deleted]
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