Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

FTC announces "click-to-cancel" rule making it easier to cancel subscriptions

ftc.gov

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

381–390 of 793 posts

Re: FTC announces "click-to-cancel" rule making it easier to cancel subscriptions

#381

Post by askafriend »

llm_nerd wrote: post #368
megiddo wrote: post #309

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, maybe technically. But the "its yearly with a cancellation fee" was not qualified in the sales information on the sign-up page. Maybe it was in the fine print. Given that customers are quite used to a monthly fee is a monthly subscription model, it was disingenuous at best. Putting significant terms in the fine print doesn't exactly engender trust.

https://imgur.com/a/ldhiEtf There is no fine print. It is extremely clear and obvious. If you see a term called "Annual paid monthly", 33% less expensive than a monthly option right above, what possible other interpretation can someone have?

I'm glad you're bringing screenshots to the conversation because so often people just talk about what they feel without grounding it in anything.

What the screenshot makes clear is that you'd have to be a single-celled organism to not understand what you're signing up for...

The screen is extremely clear, upfront and even the supposed "fine print" is in huge font with any easy link to learn more.

Re: FTC announces "click-to-cancel" rule making it easier to cancel subscriptions

#382

Post by enragedcacti »

r00fus wrote: post #317
enragedcacti wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have good news! (as long as Lina Khan stays on as commissioner) > FTC Proposes Rule to Ban Junk Fees: The proposed rule would ban businesses from running up the bills with hidden and bogus fees, ensure consumers know exactly how much they are paying and what they are getting, and help spur companies to compete on offering the lowest price. Businesses would have to include all mandatory fees when telling consumers a…

> (as long as Lina Khan stays on as commissioner) She may not be around for long (a travesty in my opinion if so). Neither presidential candidate is stumping for her kind of activism, even the Dem one. And the big money wants her gone. Sure we can vote, but it seems big money has more influence regardless.

> Neither presidential candidate is stumping for her kind of activism, even the Dem one

Harris hasn't outright said she would keep on Khan, but from a policy perspective I think they are very aligned, even to the point of Harris copying Khan's homework a bit (not in a bad way, just interesting). They have both explicitly called out grocery revenue growth exceeding total costs, both want to go after PBMs to lower drug prices, both want to go after junk fees, both have come out against algorithmic rent pricing, both have called out misclassification of workers.

If Harris does want to keep her on I still don't think it's in either of their interests for Harris to stake out a position. It opens the Harris campaign up to attacks on Khan's many court setbacks and erodes whatever bipartisan support Khan still has. Also, Harris doesn't have to do anything to keep her on, if she doesn't appoint anyone then by law Khan will remain acting commissioner indefinitely.

Re: FTC announces "click-to-cancel" rule making it easier to cancel subscriptions

#383

Post by rootusrootus »

Anduia wrote: post #372
rootusrootus wrote: post #333

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As much as I used to hate them, I've now gained an appreciation for PayPal for this kind of stuff. For when I don't want to give my credit card to yet another vendor to possibly be compromised, or manage a sketchy subscription, PayPal is a pretty good solution. I do prefer Apple, but not every subscription can be bought that way.

Don't you pay more if you use Apple instead of Paypal?

Sometimes, but not always. As long as the difference is not too significant, the control over the subscription is worth it to me. Some people don't like 'em, I get it, but when you stay primarily inside their ecosystem it does work pretty seamlessly for most things.

Re: FTC announces "click-to-cancel" rule making it easier to cancel subscriptions

#384

Post by lazyasciiart »

inetknght wrote: post #378
vel0city wrote: post #361

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So what, people should only be able to email you if you've previously emailed them? How am I supposed to know who I'm allowed to email?

> So what, people should only be able to email you if you've previously emailed them? No, people should be able to email me as they would normally. I should be able to block senders, or entire domains. To use a direct example: if I decide that substack is shit because they subscribe people without consent (which is exactly true), then I should be able to block all things from substack and not just a single email addr…

> then the spammer should be legally and monetarily liable for the time and money wasted

You might want to start by addressing physical mail, or advertising billboards, if you want to radically overhaul some of the fundamentals of society.

Re: FTC announces "click-to-cancel" rule making it easier to cancel subscriptions

#385

Post by mitthrowaway2 »

justinpombrio wrote: post #265
Uehreka wrote: post #190

When people try and say that regulating stuff like this is impossible, I often think about how unreasonably great the regulations around “Unsubscribe” links in emails are. There really seems to be no loophole or workaround despite there being huge incentive for there to be one. Every time I click an “Unsubscribe” link in an email (it seems like they’re forced to say “Unsubscribe” and not use weasel words to hide the…

Unsubscribe links are a fantastic regulation, but there is a workaround. I must have received at least a dozen emails from Brown after graduating despite unsubscribing to every email they sent. The trouble is they're endlessly creative about the lists they put you on. I'd get one email from "Alumni Connections" and then another from "Faculty Spotlight" and then another from "Global Outreach" and then another from "Ev…

I've also found unsubscribe links that don't do anything. Like the unsubscribe link simply fails to work; nothing happens when you click on it.

Re: FTC announces "click-to-cancel" rule making it easier to cancel subscriptions

#386

Post by 8note »

doctorpangloss wrote: post #133
nerdjon wrote: post #56

> will require sellers to make it as easy for consumers to cancel their enrollment as it was to sign up. I am very curious what exactly this means? Is it the number of pages or forms you had to fill out? People you had to talk too? So if for my internet I had to have someone come out to install it before service would start could they argue that they require someone to physically come out to turn off service? Or a ca…

> I really wish they just required what Apple requires on the App Store. It requires 2 clicks, clicking cancel and then confirm. No upselling since it all happens within Apple's Settings. It's complicated. If all anti-piracy measures were enforced successfully, such as they are on Apple platforms; if there were insurmountable paywalls everywhere; but, subscriptions were cheaper, would you be better off? What about th…

If antipiracy measures were perfect, I think we'd see a drastic increase in subscription prices rather than a decrease

Re: FTC announces "click-to-cancel" rule making it easier to cancel subscriptions

#387

Post by Spoom »

megiddo wrote: post #226
TheAceOfHearts wrote: post #96

It would be great to see the FTC go against predatory subscription services like Adobe. I'm fuzzy on the exact details, but I think they promoted a yearly subscription that was meant to look like a monthly subscription, where if you cancelled early they would charge you an exorbitant cancellation fee. I'm not sure how these new rules affect them. One recent idea I've had is that many online subscription services shou…

Let me regale you with the story of my Adobe Subscription cancellation. I had been considering learning Illustrator and to align myself, I decided to get a little skin the game. I signed up for the "monthly" subscription. I downloaded Illustrator, and this screenshot was my entire experience: https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fexternal-prev... Suffice it to say, this didn't meet my expectations. I thus de…

Great story, but you should be careful with this method if you care about your credit. They are arguably within their rights to report this to the credit agencies as an unpaid debt and send it to collections, including the cancellation fee since they can point to the clickwrap contract that states it.

Re: FTC announces "click-to-cancel" rule making it easier to cancel subscriptions

#388

Post by IggleSniggle »

WalterBright wrote: post #377

Disney+ had a "cancel anytime!" message on its web pages. But I could never find a cancel button on any of them. So I called my credit card company and put a block on any charges from Disney.

This is essentially the reason I do my subscriptions as Apple mediated. It always feels a little dirty to prop up that situation, but it's a legit valuable service to me that they make it so easy manage subscriptions and see payment tiers _indirectly_ from the seller

Re: FTC announces "click-to-cancel" rule making it easier to cancel subscriptions

#390

Post by Ciunkos »

paradox460 wrote: post #359
Uehreka wrote: post #190

When people try and say that regulating stuff like this is impossible, I often think about how unreasonably great the regulations around “Unsubscribe” links in emails are. There really seems to be no loophole or workaround despite there being huge incentive for there to be one. Every time I click an “Unsubscribe” link in an email (it seems like they’re forced to say “Unsubscribe” and not use weasel words to hide the…

Until the link tries to redirect through their click tracking service, and is blocked by my firewall. Really dislike that Imo it should be a single header that points to a url that accepts a post payload. Email clients could then surface the link

There is already a header for that: List-Unsubscribe with the URL, and the List-Unsubscribe-Post to support one-click unsubscribes, which Google and Yahoo began enforcing for bulk senders in February this year.
Post reply on HN