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Nobel Peace Prize for 2024 awarded to Nihon Hidankyo

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Re: Nobel Peace Prize for 2024 awarded to Nihon Hidankyo

#351

Post by js8 »

wk_end wrote: post #325
mc32 wrote: post #309

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would you say the Cuban missile crisis was made up by the Kennedy admin? The establishment was ready to war if the missiles were not removed. Being in our “backyard” and sphere of influence (LatAm) we didn’t take to it too kindly.

I would say that the Cuban Missile Crisis, indeed, would not have constituted a good reason to invade Cuba. US foreign policy during the Cold War was often pretty indefensible. But there’s still a number of things about this situation that make the comparison flimsy. The relationship between the west and Russia was - and actually still is - significantly less tense than the relationship between the Soviets and the we…

> Ukraine was not made a member of NATO - it hadn’t even applied. At no point did Russia even rattle any sabres, offer red lines, or pursue diplomacy.

I don't think you're paying attention. Bush's invite of Ukraine and Georgia into NATO in 2007 (against the opinion of France and Germany) was probably a cause of Russian invasion into South Ossetia.

And just about recently a newly chosen top NATO chief has been promoting path for Ukraine to enter NATO (and so-called "West Germany model"), despite that Putin clearly demanded Ukraine neutrality and NATO's own rule about not admitting members with an ongoing territorial disputes.

I can hardly imagine how could Russians be clearer about opposing NATO expansion.

Re: Nobel Peace Prize for 2024 awarded to Nihon Hidankyo

#352

Post by userbinator »

satvikpendem wrote: post #106

I recently went to the Hiroshima museum. I had originally thought that people simply vaporized when the bomb hit, but that is not the case. The museum shows how people's skin simply sloughed off and some were holding parts in their hands as they walked around to find their loved ones. But the worst part was radiation poisoning. Many that did not initially get hit and burned directly went towards the center of the cit…

You should also visit the Pearl Harbor memorial, to understand what lead to the events at Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

Re: Nobel Peace Prize for 2024 awarded to Nihon Hidankyo

#353

Post by aguaviva »

js8 wrote: post #351
wk_end wrote: post #325

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would say that the Cuban Missile Crisis, indeed, would not have constituted a good reason to invade Cuba. US foreign policy during the Cold War was often pretty indefensible. But there’s still a number of things about this situation that make the comparison flimsy. The relationship between the west and Russia was - and actually still is - significantly less tense than the relationship between the Soviets and the we…

> Ukraine was not made a member of NATO - it hadn’t even applied. At no point did Russia even rattle any sabres, offer red lines, or pursue diplomacy. I don't think you're paying attention. Bush's invite of Ukraine and Georgia into NATO in 2007 (against the opinion of France and Germany) was probably a cause of Russian invasion into South Ossetia. And just about recently a newly chosen top NATO chief has been promoti…

Bush's invite of Ukraine and Georgia into NATO in 2007 (against the opinion of France and Germany) was probably a cause of Russian invasion into South Ossetia.

Bush did not "invite" those countries to join NATO. Only NATO can do that, and it famously chose not to do that at the Bucharest Summit the following year (and to explicitly deny those countries invites), precisely because of France and Germany's objections. I'm not sure what you think you can gain here by attempting to spin the situation into the opposite of what it was.

Regardless - the "cause" of what Russian armed forces did in Georgia in 2008 was Putin's ordering them to. Nothing the West did made or "caused" him to do anything.

I can hardly imagine how could Russians be clearer about opposing NATO expansion.

Post-2022 the discussion is entirely moot, and I don't see why the world should begin to care what the current Russian regime thinks about NATO at this point.

NATO expansion was never the real reason for that invasion - but once Putin chose to go in, he completely extinguished whatever moral capital Russia may have had that issue.

Re: Nobel Peace Prize for 2024 awarded to Nihon Hidankyo

#354

Post by ghysznje »

Foreignborn wrote: post #337
melasadra wrote: post #69

As some other commenters have pointed out: It is lamentable that the focus is almost always on the atomic bombing itself instead of why it came to that point at all. Many Asian countries feel scant sympathy toward Japan. From Indonesia to Malaysia to the Philipipines or even worse and for much longer, in Korea and China. In each of these countries the Japanese perpetrated massacre, forced labour, gang rape and forced…

You can separate one group of innocents killed horrifically from other innocents killed horrifically. No one goes around expecting New York City to attone for the events that led up to 9/11.

What did nyc or the US do to deserve 9/11? On the other hand what Japan has (usually brutally) killed way more innocent people in Asia than those killed by the A-bombs

Re: Nobel Peace Prize for 2024 awarded to Nihon Hidankyo

#355

Post by satvikpendem »

userbinator wrote: post #352
satvikpendem wrote: post #106

I recently went to the Hiroshima museum. I had originally thought that people simply vaporized when the bomb hit, but that is not the case. The museum shows how people's skin simply sloughed off and some were holding parts in their hands as they walked around to find their loved ones. But the worst part was radiation poisoning. Many that did not initially get hit and burned directly went towards the center of the cit…

You should also visit the Pearl Harbor memorial, to understand what lead to the events at Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

Indeed. I did find it interesting that the museum made no mention of the atrocities committed by the Japanese military in China as well, or even any discussion of Pearl Harbor beyond a mere mention that Japan attacked it. But then again, that doesn't really have anything to do with the suffering experienced by the populace, as the sins of the government should not be atoned by the governed.

Re: Nobel Peace Prize for 2024 awarded to Nihon Hidankyo

#356

Post by fifilura »

Manabu-eo wrote: post #263
fifilura wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I imagine that if you can colonize other planets you can also target them with nuclear weapons. It is like saying that the solution to all problems is colonizing Antarctica.

It's much easier to intercept said nuclear weapon because instead of minutes you would have months to do it. And attacking Mars outside the few months every two years that have the most favorable transfer windows would also be much more difficult. It's a non-trivial advantage. Of course, if you have nuclear weapons already on Mars that can be remotely triggered from Earth this doesn't apply, but hopefully we can avoi…

TBH I think this whole discussion - that fixing Mars should be easier than fixing Earth - is some proof that a lot of hacker news commenters are already aliens from Mars.

Re: Nobel Peace Prize for 2024 awarded to Nihon Hidankyo

#357

Post by Foreignborn »

ghysznje wrote: post #354
Foreignborn wrote: post #337

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can separate one group of innocents killed horrifically from other innocents killed horrifically. No one goes around expecting New York City to attone for the events that led up to 9/11.

What did nyc or the US do to deserve 9/11? On the other hand what Japan has (usually brutally) killed way more innocent people in Asia than those killed by the A-bombs

No one said deserve.

But if we’re just going to use the states’ body counts as justification, you’ve sort of answered your own question.

Re: Nobel Peace Prize for 2024 awarded to Nihon Hidankyo

#358

Post by lifthrasiir »

satvikpendem wrote: post #355
userbinator wrote: post #352

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You should also visit the Pearl Harbor memorial, to understand what lead to the events at Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

Indeed. I did find it interesting that the museum made no mention of the atrocities committed by the Japanese military in China as well, or even any discussion of Pearl Harbor beyond a mere mention that Japan attacked it. But then again, that doesn't really have anything to do with the suffering experienced by the populace, as the sins of the government should not be atoned by the governed.

It should be noted that up to 15% of all hibakushas were Koreans, who were seen as second-class citizens in Japan in spite of the government propaganda that annexed Koreans are given same rights as Japaneses. So the lack of statements about wrongdoings of the former Japan empire, including WW2, is certainly relevant here.

(Just in case, Nixon Hidangyo is clearly aware of this and has campaigned for proper recognition of Korean survivors for a long time.)

Re: Nobel Peace Prize for 2024 awarded to Nihon Hidankyo

#359

Post by satvikpendem »

lifthrasiir wrote: post #358
satvikpendem wrote: post #355

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed. I did find it interesting that the museum made no mention of the atrocities committed by the Japanese military in China as well, or even any discussion of Pearl Harbor beyond a mere mention that Japan attacked it. But then again, that doesn't really have anything to do with the suffering experienced by the populace, as the sins of the government should not be atoned by the governed.

It should be noted that up to 15% of all hibakushas were Koreans, who were seen as second-class citizens in Japan in spite of the government propaganda that annexed Koreans are given same rights as Japaneses. So the lack of statements about wrongdoings of the former Japan empire, including WW2, is certainly relevant here. (Just in case, Nixon Hidangyo is clearly aware of this and has campaigned for proper recognition…

I went to Korea after Japan and they in fact do have museums dedicated to this fact. It's quite enlightening to visit various countries who've been subject to the same historical events and see where each ones bias lies. I felt the same in Vietnam with their museums.

Re: Nobel Peace Prize for 2024 awarded to Nihon Hidankyo

#360

Post by libertine »

Hammershaft wrote: post #226
mc32 wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Totally agree this is very relevant today. We have heads of state in the EU and to some degree people in the USG with very cavalier approaches to the ideological war between the West and the BRICS. I really don't know what the F* they are thinking but they keep pushing further and further and hope there is no elastic snap. It's like they forgot about diplomacy with enemies --at the height of the cold war, at its Apex…

BRICS? What ideological war is South Africa, India, and Brazil waging against the west? Members of Brics such as India and China are closer to war with each other then they are to war with the West.

You're exposing the whole Russian narrative about a new "multipolar world", which has already existed since globalization was a thing, from the oppressed "Global South"... which is a:

- a geographical misconception - for example, India is part of the Northern Hemisphere and a lot of Western aligned countries are in the Southern Hemisphere like Australia, New Zealand, Argentina;

- a population size misconception, where the propaganda states the majority of the world population is in the south - 850 million people live in the southern hemisphere;

- It's a sign of imperialism - no countries from the actual Southern Hemisphere elected Russia as their representatives and to speak for them about their ideas, grievances, or ideology.

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