731–740 of 788 posts
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That's not entirely true. Waymo have remote control operators, these would have the same - you don't need 100% foolproof autonomy to operate a fleet of cars like this. I am also highly sceptical of everything about Tesla's program though
You're going to buy a personal car that can be remoted into at any time?
It's ironic that the example he gives for driving across LA already has a fast train connection: > People that live in LA, I mean try to get from Pasadena to El Segundo during rush hour. You can fly to another city faster than you get to crosstown LA. And you have to drive the whole way. You can take the Metro A line from Pasadena, then transfer to the C line to get to El Segundo. No driving necessary. Musk sells car…
Trains are great Unless you think LA should go London/NYC style and build a load of stations, there is still the problem of what to do if you're not near a station at the start or end. If it involves a bus connection, people will just drive
LA is literally filled to the fucking brim with parking lots, so many fucking parking lots. You have enough space for more stations then Paris.
And yet somehow in most large cities people use trams and bus in large numbers and don't 'just drive'. Crazy to consider that some people don't even have to own a car in such a city. If you have proper transportation infrastructure, those buses/trams can be faster then private car traffic.
Its called a 'transportation system' for a reason, walking, biking, buses, trams, trains all work together to provide something that practically moves millions of people a day even in the largest cities in the world.
I for one cannot wait to run my cloud infrastructure on Tesla Web Services
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> Unless you think LA should go London/NYC style and build a load of stations Why shouldn’t one think that? Wouldn’t this be a good solution?
Absolutely it’s a great solution. It will cost a few hundred billion and be done in the 2050s at best. When do we start? Call our local representative?
In some sense US cities are actually well prepared, they have tons of space on their gigantic roads to have priority bus lanes, bike lanes and many other things like that. Road safety and transportation could be improved by a gigantic amount with simply changes in road design and investment patterns.
How to achieve that politically, well, I don't know.
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I don't think Tesla have an advantage in manufacturing. China today is what Japan was in the 70s and their processes are so fucking good. You can't win on manufacturing - this is, after all, a nation that is now building Volvo's better than the Swedes did. Tesla fell into the China partnership trap, where the gov subsidises you and you open a "partnership" there, meanwhile they take your IP and knowledge for the bene…
NZ has cheap BYDs, etc and Tesla still vastly outsells them.
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No, remote operators are never in control of the vehicles. They give the computer hints about how to handle situations it's unable to resolve for itself, but the computer is ultimately still responsible for driving and maintaining the safety invariants. This is fundamentally different from FSD, where the human is always responsible for driving and maintaining the safety invariants.
"They give the computer hints about how to handle situations" That's a cute euphemism for remote operators.
https://users.ece.cmu.edu/~koopman/j3016/J3016_table.jpg
To give an analogy, let's say you use a credit card. A machine processes the payment most of the time, but occasionally something looks suspicious, so it denies the payment and sends a message to a human (you) asking whether the next payment should be allowed. Do you consider yourself to be a "driver" in this system?
If so, imagine a system where all payments flash by onscreen for a human that's tasked with stopping erroneous approvals in realtime. Are humans doing the essentially the same job in this system such that both roles are "drivers"?
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If you can't recognize his contributions I think you're too emotionally attached to the question.
I do recognise his major contributions: Made electric cars commonplace sooner than I thought with the Model S, financed SpaceX's doubtlessly awesome progress, and... well that's pretty much it. Thing is, the illusion is fading, his previously "inscrutable" politics are on his sleeve, and you can't just pretend he's not a complete liability for any company because of his irrational, and frankly childish, behaviour.
> Made electric cars commonplace sooner than I thought with the Model S
You mean financing and leading the largest EV maker in the world and fundamentally changing a 100 year old industry.
Car industry has been considered for a long time a incredibly hard place to get into for a startup. Most new companies happened when industrial powers rose and supported local companies.
There are decades of failed car companies. And at the same time as Tesla, there were other companies who promised EV revolutions and failed.
People point to the Model S, but the Model 3 was actually just as or more important. When the Model 3 showed profitability ever car company in the world massively increased their investment in EV, before that many companies were pretending and doing research. For years the story was EV can't be profitable below 50k and you can't build them at volume.
> financed SpaceX's doubtlessly awesome progress
If with 'finacned' you mean founded and lead the largest SpaceX company in the world that has revolutionized the whole space industry and is the biggest rocket company and the biggest sat company that can also fly people to space and build the biggest rocket in the history of humanity.
SpaceX Starlink literally fundamentally changed the largest war in Europe since WW2.
But I guess all he did is 'financed progress'. You got to be fucking kidding me.
> and you can't just pretend he's not a complete liability
Can you spell out in actual real terms what this means? SpaceX is going from success to success and has been for 25 years now. Tesla is still a large company doing pretty well. Both companies are much bigger and much more important and powerful then they were 4 years ago.
In the real world, customers don't care about 'childish' behavior. And claiming he is irrational when his companies mostly act rationally on net (no companies is perfect and never makes errors) also don't really work very well.
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> Unless you think LA should go London/NYC style and build a load of stations Why shouldn’t one think that? Wouldn’t this be a good solution?
Absolutely it’s a great solution. It will cost a few hundred billion and be done in the 2050s at best. When do we start? Call our local representative?
https://planning.lacity.gov/odocument/d2143d14-572d-4dc2-911...
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I use it every day, but HN says it doesn’t work
If it worked, why postpone all of this? Again? It works 'well enough' when there is a human on board, without one, it's just not safe enough yet.
Here's an idea - take the Robocab car design, strip out all the FSD/autopilot stuff, put in a steering wheel and dash and sell it starting at the end of the year for ~$25k. It would sell +++
It has no rear window and wacky doors and only two seats. It would not sell. It's purpose built as an autonomous taxi, where those choices make perfect sense. They are also doing a $25k car, they just aren't revealing it today.
