Mira Murati leaves OpenAI • Hacker News Board

Re: Mira Murati leaves OpenAI

#481

Post by fsndz » Thu, Sep 26, 2024, 9:10 AM UTC

jjulius wrote: post #173

deepGem wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is it so hard to just accept this and be transparent about motives ? It's fair to say 'we were not aligned with Sam, we tried an ouster, didn't pan out so the best thing for us to do is to leave and let Sam pursue his path", which the entirely company has vouched for. Instead, you get to see grey area after grey area.

Because, for some weird reason, our culture has collectively decided that, even if most of us are capable of reading between the lines to understand what's really being said or is happening, it's often wrong and bad to be honest and transparent, and we should put the most positive spin possible on it. It's everywhere, especially in professional and political environments.

hypocrisy has to be the core of every corporate or political environment I have observed recently. I can count the occasions or situations where telling the simple truth is helpful. even the people who tell you to tell the truth are often the ones incapable of handling it.

Re: Mira Murati leaves OpenAI

#482

Post by svara » Thu, Sep 26, 2024, 9:14 AM UTC

some1else wrote: post #343

svara wrote: post #272

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My suspicion is that you're leaving some important parts in your logic unstated. Such as belief in a magical property within humans of "understanding", which you don't define. The ability of video models to generate novel video consistent with physical reality shows that they have extracted important invariants - physical law - out of the data. It's probably better not to muddle the discussion with ill defined terms…

"Allegory of the cave" comes to mind, when trying to describe the understanding that's missing from diffusion models. I think a super-model with such qualifications would require a number of ControlNets in a non-visual domains to be able to encode understanding of the underlying physics. Diffusion models can render permutations of whatever they've seen fairly well without that, though.

I'm very familiar with the allegory of the cave, but I'm not sure I understand where you're going with the analogy here.

Are you saying that it is not possible to learn about dynamics in a higher dimensional space from a lower dimensional projection? This is clearly not true in general.

E.g., video models learn that even though they're only ever seeing and outputting 2d data, objects have different sides in a fashio that is consistent with our 3d reality.

The distinctions you (and others in this thread) are making is purely one of degree - how much generalization has been achieved, and how well - versus one of category.

Re: Mira Murati leaves OpenAI

#483

Post by Yizahi » Thu, Sep 26, 2024, 9:22 AM UTC

tazu wrote: post #387

nojvek wrote: post #207

Prediction: OpenAI will implode by 2030 and become a smaller shell of current as they run out of money by spending too much. Prediction 2: Russia will implode by 2035, by also spending too much money.

Russia's debt to GDP ratio is 20%. The United States' debt to GDP ratio is 123%.

Lol, ruzzian GDP is completely inflated by the war. Every single tank or rocket produced and burned down is a net GDP boost on paper, and destruction of that same equipment is not reflected in it. Ruzzia will not implode any time soon, we have seen that people can live in much worse conditions for decades (Venezuela, Best Korea, Haiti etc.) but don't delude your self that it is some economic powerhouse. It's not for quite some time now because they are essentially burning their money and workforce.

Re: Mira Murati leaves OpenAI

#484

Post by presentation » Thu, Sep 26, 2024, 9:37 AM UTC

onlyrealcuzzo wrote: post #253

keeptrying wrote: post #57

If OpenAI is the foremost in solving the AGI - possibly the biggest invention of mankind - it's a little weird that everyone's dropping out. Does it not look like that no one wants to work with Sam in the long run?

Doesn't (dyst)OpenAI have a clause that you can't say anything bad about the company after leaving? I'm not convinced these board members are able to say what they want when leaving.

That (dyst) is a big stretch lol

Re: Mira Murati leaves OpenAI

#485

Post by rsynnott » Thu, Sep 26, 2024, 9:38 AM UTC

usaar333 wrote: post #416

zooq_ai wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1 you use 1 2 (or even 3) you use "a couple" A few is almost always > 3 and one could argue that upper limit 15 So, 10 years to 50 years

few is not > 3. Literally it's just >= 2, though I think >= 3 is the common definition. 15 is too high to be a "few" except in contexts of a few out of tens of thousands of items. Realistically I interpret this as 3-7 thousands of days (8 to 19 years), which is largely consensus prediction range anyway.

While it's not really _wrong_ to describe two things as 'a few', as such, it's unusual and people don't really do it in standard English.

That said, I think people are possibly overanalysing this very vague barely-even-a-claim just a little. Realistically, when a tech company makes a vague claim about what'll happen in 10 years, that should be given precisely zero weight; based on historical precedent you might as well ask a magic 8-ball.

Re: Mira Murati leaves OpenAI

#486

Post by rsynnott » Thu, Sep 26, 2024, 9:39 AM UTC

threeseed wrote: post #279

bottlepalm wrote: post #268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Given that ChatGPT is already smarter and faster than humans in many different metrics. Once the other metrics catch up with humans it will still be better than humans in the existing metrics. Therefore there will be no AGI, only ASI.

My fridge is already smarter and faster than humans in many different metrics. Has been this way since calculation machines were invented hundreds of years ago.

_Thousands_; an abacus can outperform any unaided human at certain tasks.

Re: Mira Murati leaves OpenAI

#487

Post by dragonelite » Thu, Sep 26, 2024, 9:40 AM UTC

fsndz wrote: post #481

jjulius wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because, for some weird reason, our culture has collectively decided that, even if most of us are capable of reading between the lines to understand what's really being said or is happening, it's often wrong and bad to be honest and transparent, and we should put the most positive spin possible on it. It's everywhere, especially in professional and political environments.

hypocrisy has to be the core of every corporate or political environment I have observed recently. I can count the occasions or situations where telling the simple truth is helpful. even the people who tell you to tell the truth are often the ones incapable of handling it.

From experience unless the person mention their next "adventure"(within like a couple of months) or gig it usually means a manager or c-suite person got axed and was given the option to gracefully exit.

Re: Mira Murati leaves OpenAI

#488

Post by presentation » Thu, Sep 26, 2024, 9:42 AM UTC

mr90210 wrote: post #254

squigz wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do you think their motivations might be?

Speaking for myself, I'd keep working even if I had 100M. As long as I am healthy, I plan to continue on being productive towards something I find interesting.

What would you be working on though? I agree that I’d keep working if only since I like my work and not having that structure can make your life worse, not better; but if it’s “how I get to 1B” then that’s the kind of challenge that turns me off. I’m all for continually challenging yourself but I don’t want that kind of stress in my life, I’d rather find my challenges elsewhere.

Re: Mira Murati leaves OpenAI

#489

Post by MavisBacon » Thu, Sep 26, 2024, 9:43 AM UTC

g8oz wrote: post #396

ac29 wrote: post #275

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the company is still shipping, like no other Meta, Anthropic, Google, and others all are shipping state of the art models. I'm not trying to be dismissive of OpenAI's work, but they are absolutely not the only company shipping very large foundation models.

Indeed Anthropic is just as good, if not better in my sample size of one. Which is great because OpenAI as an org gives shady vibes - maybe it's just Altman, but he is running the show.

Claude is pretty brilliant.

Re: Mira Murati leaves OpenAI

#490

Post by brap » Thu, Sep 26, 2024, 9:46 AM UTC

layer8 wrote: post #39

Plain-text version for those who can’t read images: “ Hi all, I have something to share with you. After much reflection, I have made the difficult decision to leave OpenAI. My six-and-a-half years with the OpenAI team have been an extraordinary privilege. While I'll express my gratitude to many individuals in the coming days, I want to start by thanking Sam and Greg for their trust in me to lead the technical organiz…

Plain-English version for those who can’t deal with meaningless corpspeak babble:

”I’m leaving.

Mira”