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Backlash over Amazon's return to office comes as workers demand higher wages

arstechnica.com

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Re: Backlash over Amazon's return to office comes as workers demand higher wages

#41

RTO seems to have nothing to do with the warehouse workers asking for a piddly $25/hour and health and safety guarantees. It's flabberghasting that the union votes keep failing.

Union-busting campaigns are extremely effective, and honestly labor unions have gotten very lazy about building new units. "Hot shop" focused organizing plus a "we'll fire you if you sign the card (not really :) ) (yes really >:) )" poster in every breakroom and it's a big uphill battle for the workers.

Re: Backlash over Amazon's return to office comes as workers demand higher wages

#43
post #24

I wonder what drives these decisions? Is there that much solid evidence that they get more value out of people in the office rather than home? Or are there other reasons like tax incentives that encourage in-person work over remote? Is this just a control thing or or there a compelling argument that I am missing?

One possible reason might be commercial real estate investments made by decision makers, who need these properties to remain valuable.

The chain is a little longer, and a little less intentional, IME.

CRE firm lobbies local politicians that remote work is killing Main Street.

Local politicians attach tax breaks/incentives for companies with office workers.

Companies mandate RTO to save some tax money while unwittingly being a toadie for commercial real estate.

The key difference being that the people mandating RTO aren't biased because of their own investments in CRE.

Re: Backlash over Amazon's return to office comes as workers demand higher wages

#44
post #17

Amazon tech workers should unionize.

Curious what percentage of Amazon SWEs are H1B, because in my experience people who's ability to live in this country is tied to their continued employment are highly reticent to do anything that might rock that boat (like sign a union card).

Re: Backlash over Amazon's return to office comes as workers demand higher wages

#45
post #17

Amazon tech workers should unionize.

If employees at a company that I started wanted to unionize, I'd be wracking my brain to figure out why, since I'd make sure everyone is treated better than they could get with unions.

But if employees at Amazon wanted to unionize, I think the company could make several good guesses why, all of them true.

Re: Backlash over Amazon's return to office comes as workers demand higher wages

#46
This article seems to be more about warehouse workers than corporate workers. The warehouse workers have no choice but to come to the office. I do think they deserve more pay and benefits though. Amazon is pointing at what they’re providing as being competitive or industry leading, but that hides the reality of working at a grueling warehouse where everyone is pushed to physical limits and measured in brutal ways. That type of work takes a toll. And I don’t mean just the people who have experienced injuries and filed lawsuits, but everyone. They will probably all have some lasting health impact. They should be compensated much more for how Amazon runs those warehouses.

As for the return to office aspect: if employees - especially those with families that live in homes that are only affordable or available further away - have to lose 1-2 hours commuting each way, then yes they do deserve additional compensation to make up for the RTO policy. I’m sure Andy Jassy won’t recognize that or offer it up though. He and Jeff Bezos share a view that work life balance is “debilitating” (https://www.savvydime.com/jeff-bezos-believes-work-life-bala...) and Bezos has used code phrases before that suggest he favors young workers - which may be why this policy will hurt older workers and those with children the most.

Re: Backlash over Amazon's return to office comes as workers demand higher wages

#47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a sneaky way of doing layoffs, everyone who won't comply has to "quit"

It's an excellent way of getting your best people who have options to quit while the worst ones who don't are forced to stick around

[deleted]

Re: Backlash over Amazon's return to office comes as workers demand higher wages

#48

I wonder what drives these decisions? Is there that much solid evidence that they get more value out of people in the office rather than home? Or are there other reasons like tax incentives that encourage in-person work over remote? Is this just a control thing or or there a compelling argument that I am missing?

The management want return to office and that's it.

Why does there need to be something "driving the decision"?

You may as well ask why I want my cleaner to descale the bottom of my taps. There may well be no reason beyond aesthetic preference.

Maybe it's not more profitable or less profitable. Maybe it's within margin of error, and maybe the people running Amazon for the most part prefer working in an office.

Re: Backlash over Amazon's return to office comes as workers demand higher wages

#49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a sneaky way of doing layoffs, everyone who won't comply has to "quit"

Why would Amazon prefer that to layoffs or more aggressive performance standards?

Less liability.

Re: Backlash over Amazon's return to office comes as workers demand higher wages

#50
It doesn't seem like a coincidence that Amazon's RTO is being paired with a middle manager haircut.

With less middle managers, the executives are probably thinking they'll need individual contributors physically present in order to monitor them effectively.

I still can't imagine why anyone agrees to work at a place that treats it's employees like children.

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