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Everyone says Chrome devastates Mac battery life, but does it? 36 hour test

birchtree.me

101–110 of 112 posts

Re: Everyone says Chrome devastates Mac battery life, but does it? 36 hour test

#101

He didn't mention an ad blocker. I wonder if that would change things. Especially if (like me) he's got an ad blocker in Chrome but not in Safari.

He did though:

> […] but I did install an ad blocker on both for a few tests, but they didn’t change the results at all for me.

Re: Everyone says Chrome devastates Mac battery life, but does it? 36 hour test

#102
post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The web standards are the most egregious example of this. Of course they are, the end game is browsers being the OS. But it's way too risky to give web sites direct unfettered access to the computer (ActiveX, remember the time and the many ways you could be fucked by that?), so a loooot of stuff has to be built as abstractions. WebGL/WebGPU, WebUSB, WebSerial, WebBluetooth... the only thing I'm still pissed about t…

> Of course they are, the end game is browsers being the OS. But could we please not do that? Can I do something to prevent this from happening?

Take a look at how Apple killed Flash: they made a product that people flocked to, that didn't support Flash. This put vendors that didn't use Flash at an advantage compared to those that did, which started a vicious cycle for Flash.

The same can be done with JS.

Re: Everyone says Chrome devastates Mac battery life, but does it? 36 hour test

#103
post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Of course they are, the end game is browsers being the OS. But could we please not do that? Can I do something to prevent this from happening?

Take a look at how Apple killed Flash: they made a product that people flocked to, that didn't support Flash. This put vendors that didn't use Flash at an advantage compared to those that did, which started a vicious cycle for Flash. The same can be done with JS.

I don't want to get rid of JS entirely, I want to discourage building apps with it. I want it to be the macro language for hypertext like it was originally intended.

Re: Everyone says Chrome devastates Mac battery life, but does it? 36 hour test

#104
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn't realize John Gruber had reached "cult leader" levels of apologism.

He has a huge hard on for hating on the EU for daring to regulate Apple. It’s been endless hit pieces about how they suck at innovation and how having Apple Intelligence is better than having Fortnite and how users having the option to install what they want on their device is the worst thing to ever happen. Hypocritically being silent when China forces Apple to adopt RCS and has countless regulations on what they ca…

> Hypocritically being silent when China forces Apple to adopt RCS and has countless regulations on what they can do.

He recognizes China forcing Apple's hand (not the EU) when it comes to RCS, and since China is a large market, and Apple is mostly/generally a hardware company, they want to sell hardware there:

* https://daringfireball.net/2024/02/eu_rcs_imessage

Gruber is not a fan of RCS because it lacks E2E encryption:

* https://daringfireball.net/2024/07/att_data_breach_rcs_ios

When I read that post, I didn't necessarily disagree with Gruber on the encryption front, I just think having a better base for 'cross-platform' message that didn't involve third-party software (Signal, WhatsApp (and having to use their infra)) was still worth it—even if unencrypted. Gruber wants the features of RCS but also encryption:

> Ihnatko is right, but only if you believe that carrier-based messaging should remain the baseline. I do not. And it’s also a U.S.-centric viewpoint. In most countries around the world, platforms like WhatsApp, Line, and Facebook Messenger serve that role, as the baseline “everyone has it” messaging platform — and those countries are better for it. I prefer iMessage, personally, for multiple reasons, but iMessage is fundamentally limited from serving that “everyone has it” baseline role by Apple’s decision not to ship an Android client. Eddy Cue doesn’t lose many arguments but he lost that one. All of the effort spent pushing Apple to support RCS would have been better spent pushing Apple to ship iMessage for Android. And without a supported iMessage client for Android, that role ought to go to WhatsApp, not RCS. WhatsApp is free, secure, and works equally well on all phones.

> Meta knows this, and clearly smells the opportunity. Does Apple?

* Ibid

Google's E2E RCS is a proprietary extension, and I'm not sure how telcos can implement E2E given things like CALEA in the US, so E2E may be stuck in the realm of the non-telco (unlike SMS and RCS, which are telco-run).

Re: Everyone says Chrome devastates Mac battery life, but does it? 36 hour test

#105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Representative" means of a population. "Representative for me" is incoherent. You're not a population; you don't have population statistics.

True, i give you that. But saying YouTube must be included is like saying that most people watch YouTube, which is certainly not true at all.

Youtube.com is literally the #2 most popular website in the US. After google.com which is #1.

So yes, YouTube must absolutely be included. And it should be included as the second most-tested site.

Re: Everyone says Chrome devastates Mac battery life, but does it? 36 hour test

#106
post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People use it for the google account integration. Logged in to all services, all history/bookmarks/tabs/passwords syncs over.

history/bookmarks/tabs/passwords is easily synced via Safari > File > Import From > Google Chrome/Firefox and safari can log into google accounts just as easily as chrome can.

Yes, but normies won't do that. You don't even need to export, the new browser can usually import with the starting wizard.

Re: Everyone says Chrome devastates Mac battery life, but does it? 36 hour test

#107
post #90
post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, there's lots of half-fact nonsense going around in this space. But really that's the real takeaway here: the reason that "everyone knows" something that was false[1], because no one actually cares about the facts . Modern laptops do extremely well with battery life, Macbooks best among them, and frankly no one is away from a charger for that kind of period in the modern world. You know the thing will always hav…

What if—I realize this is crazy but hear me out—Chrome actually consumed more power at some point in the past? Why would Google claim that they fixed Chrome if it was never broken?

Well... did it? Again there was a hypothesis, and a measurement that disproved it. It's not very good science to say "well, the hypothesis may still have been right on this older system that wasn't measured". What you're applying is essentially conspiracy logic: you can't validate an incorrect statement by pretending that it might have been true "at some point in the past".

Re: Everyone says Chrome devastates Mac battery life, but does it? 36 hour test

#108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All browser engines are cross-platform. Safari may be Mac-only (though there used to be a Safari for Windows), but the rendering is done by WebKit.

We're talking about using features exposed by the OS (the Core Animation layers API in this example) to avoid doing unnecessary work to save battery life. Any browser could adopt each individual platform's proprietary graphics APIs, but using the same API everywhere (traditionally OpenGL) is less work.

Any browser engine is free to do the work to use per-platform APIs. If your argument is that cross-platform browser engines won't do the work to optimize with platform-specific APIs but that Safari will, WebKit is a cross-platform browser engine and so it adopting CoreAnimation on Apple platforms in addition to supporting other platforms is exactly the same amount of work that it would take for Blink or Gecko to do the same thing.

Re: Everyone says Chrome devastates Mac battery life, but does it? 36 hour test

#109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We're talking about using features exposed by the OS (the Core Animation layers API in this example) to avoid doing unnecessary work to save battery life. Any browser could adopt each individual platform's proprietary graphics APIs, but using the same API everywhere (traditionally OpenGL) is less work.

Any browser engine is free to do the work to use per-platform APIs. If your argument is that cross-platform browser engines won't do the work to optimize with platform-specific APIs but that Safari will, WebKit is a cross-platform browser engine and so it adopting CoreAnimation on Apple platforms in addition to supporting other platforms is exactly the same amount of work that it would take for Blink or Gecko to do t…

My argument is that they don't do the additional work, resulting in their energy efficiency deficit.

As pixels per inch and screen size increases, the cost of doing unnecessary rendering work becomes more noticeable.

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