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OpenAI threatens to revoke o1 access for asking it about its chain of thought

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Re: OpenAI threatens to revoke o1 access for asking it about its chain of thought

#261

Post by abenga »

bongodongobob wrote: post #244
contravariant wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could be, but 'AI model says weird shit' has almost never stuck around unless it's public (which won't happen here), really common, or really blatantly wrong. And usually at least 2 of those three. For something usually hidden the first two don't really apply that well, and the last would have to be really blatant unless you want an article about "Model recovers from mistake" which is just not interesting. And in tha…

Just no. AI being racist is still a popular meme. "Because the programmers are white males blah blah".

Why can't it be, if it were (I'm not saying that it is, mind) trained on racist material?

Re: OpenAI threatens to revoke o1 access for asking it about its chain of thought

#262

Post by irthomasthomas »

contravariant wrote: post #4

Okay this is just getting suspicious. Their excuses for keeping the chain of thought hidden are dubious at best [1], and honestly just seemed anti-competitive if anything. Worst is their argument that they want to monitor it for attempts to escape the prompt, but you can't. However the weirdest is that they note that: > for this to work the model must have freedom to express its thoughts in unaltered form, so we cann…

They don't want you to find out that O1 is five lines of bash and XML.

Re: OpenAI threatens to revoke o1 access for asking it about its chain of thought

#263

Post by Asraelite »

batch12 wrote: post #86
infecto wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Will this ever die? It feels like every time a post is made about OpenAI that someone loves to mention it.

No, it will probably never die. It is reinforced by the dissonance between their name and early philosophy and their current actions.

It should though, it's a stupid way to phrase the argument.

OpenAI pivoted from non-profit to for-profit and it's fine to criticize them for that, if that's the argument you're making. But focusing on their name specifically doesn't make sense. I mean, what do you expect, that they rebrand to something else and lose a ton of brand recognition in the process? You can't possibly expect a company do that when they have no incentive to.

Re: OpenAI threatens to revoke o1 access for asking it about its chain of thought

#264

Post by astrange »

contravariant wrote: post #4

Okay this is just getting suspicious. Their excuses for keeping the chain of thought hidden are dubious at best [1], and honestly just seemed anti-competitive if anything. Worst is their argument that they want to monitor it for attempts to escape the prompt, but you can't. However the weirdest is that they note that: > for this to work the model must have freedom to express its thoughts in unaltered form, so we cann…

> Which makes it sound like they really don't want it to become public what the model is 'thinking'.

I can see why they don't, because as they said, it's uncensored.

Here's a quick jailbreak attempt. Not posting the prompt but it's even dumber than you think it is.

https://imgur.com/a/dVbE09j

Re: OpenAI threatens to revoke o1 access for asking it about its chain of thought

#265

Post by programjames »

varenc wrote: post #85
mrinterweb wrote: post #40

The name "OpenAI" is a contraction since they don't seem "open" in any way. The only way I see "open" applying is "open for business."

This is a tired and trite comment that appears on every mention of OpenAI but contributes little to the discussion.

I think the purpose is to shift public sentiment? I lot of people in the free software world are justifiably upset over ClosedAI's marketing tactics.

Re: OpenAI threatens to revoke o1 access for asking it about its chain of thought

#267

Post by effingwewt »

qsort wrote: post #6
contravariant wrote: post #4

Okay this is just getting suspicious. Their excuses for keeping the chain of thought hidden are dubious at best [1], and honestly just seemed anti-competitive if anything. Worst is their argument that they want to monitor it for attempts to escape the prompt, but you can't. However the weirdest is that they note that: > for this to work the model must have freedom to express its thoughts in unaltered form, so we cann…

Occam's razor: there is no secret sauce and they're afraid someone trains a model on the output like what happened soon after the release of GPT-4. They basically said as much in the official announcement, you hardly even have to read between the lines.

Stop using Occam's razor like some literal law. It's a stupid and lazy philosophical theory bandied about like some catch-all solution.

Like when people say 'the definition of insanity is[some random BS] with a bullshit attribution[Albert Einstein said it!(He didn't)]

Re: OpenAI threatens to revoke o1 access for asking it about its chain of thought

#268

Post by programjames »

RivieraKid wrote: post #259
aleph_minus_one wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> OpenAI is a brand, not a literal description of the company! If the brand name is deeply contradictory to the business practices of the company, people will start making nasty puns and jokes, which can lead to serious reputation damages for the respective company.

99% of people don't care. Also, they are in some sense open, ChatGPT is openly available and they're capped-profit.

Far, far more than 1% of people care. Sure, they are open in one sense: for business. But in the tech world, "open" specifically means showing us how you got your final product. It means releasing source code rather than just binaries (even free binaries!), or sharing protocols and standards rather than keeping them proprietary (looking at you Apple and HDMI). It doesn't matter if anyone can use ChatGPT, that has nothing to do with being open.

Re: OpenAI threatens to revoke o1 access for asking it about its chain of thought

#269

Post by programjames »

RivieraKid wrote: post #258
shinycode wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well it’s fair considering people gave their content for free (which is by the way the promise made by OpenAI in the beginning, to be open)

It's not fair, market price of the data (for example Wikipedia) is zero, but the cost of what OpenAI is providing is billions.

What about ClosedAI's ignoring of people's requests to not scrape their data?

Re: OpenAI threatens to revoke o1 access for asking it about its chain of thought

#270

Post by user_7832 »

astrange wrote: post #220
COAGULOPATH wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>but much worse (and worse even in comparison to GPT4) than English composition O1 is supposed to be a reasoning model, so I don't think judging it by its English composition abilities is quite fair. When they release a true next-gen successor to GPT-4 (Orion, or whatever), we may see improvements. Everyone complains about the "ChatGPTese" writing style, and surely they'll fix that eventually. >Like they hired a few…

> When they release a true next-gen successor to GPT-4 (Orion, or whatever), we may see improvements. Everyone complains about the "ChatGPTese" writing style, and surely they'll fix that eventually. IMO that has already peaked. GPT4 original certainly was terminally corny, but competitors like Claude/Llama aren't as bad, and neither is 4o. Some of the bad writing does from things they can't/don't want to solve - "har…

I just wanted to thank you for the medium article you posted. I was online when Paul made that bizarre “delve” tweet but never knew so much about Nigeria and its English. As someone from a former British colony too I understood why using such a word was perfectly normal but wasn’t aware Kenyans and Nigerians trained ChatGPT.
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