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The vagus nerve orchestrates the mind-body connection

quantamagazine.org

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Re: The vagus nerve orchestrates the mind-body connection

#91

Post by meroes »

devilbunny wrote: post #52
mrexroad wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was being prepped for wrist/arm surgery years back and the anesthesiologist got a bit flummoxed and muttere, “huh, that’s strange… let’s get an ultrasound” while trying to administer a nerve block on my arm. I asked what and they ”oh, it’s nothing to worry about, but your nerve isn’t where it is supposed to be…”, and then knocked me out before I could ask anything else.

That’s why we use ultrasound on practically every block we do today.

Is ultra sound that little monitor they/you look at while the needle thing is in your arm to apply the nerve block? That process a bit unnerving no pun intended. I thought maybe since my arm had been tweaked by being in a full arm cast for a month even with the screen they weren’t going to find it.

Re: The vagus nerve orchestrates the mind-body connection

#92

Post by GavinMcG »

jimiray wrote: post #72
Nav_Panel wrote: post #2

I really wish these articles cited more primary sources. I would love (and prefer) to review the empirical work that led to the communicated understanding of these systems.

Look up Polyvagal Theory by Stephen Porgess. https://www.stephenporges.com/

Isn’t that what the article specifically says lacks scientific support? Thus why the comment is hoping for primary sources.

Re: The vagus nerve orchestrates the mind-body connection

#93

Post by msephton »

xandrius wrote: post #73
chucksmash wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The joy of explaining your sneezes every time you see a bright light during cold/flu/pandemic season. I'm surprised to see it affects 20+% of the population because I've never met anyone who knew what I was talking about when I said "sorry, light makes me sneeze"

For me, since childhood, it was a common fact that if one were almost going to sneeze but couldn't, they should quickly look at a bright source of light to succeed. Lights don't trigger a full sneeze if I don't need to but it always helped.

Me too!

Re: The vagus nerve orchestrates the mind-body connection

#94

Post by [deleted] »

eagerpace wrote: post #63
cosignal wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some people wonder why the use of ‘AI’ in pathology is not more effective, and this is part of the reason.

It seems like exactly the kind of thing AI will be better at than humans. If just needs to be trained on the variations instead of the textbook.

[deleted]

Re: The vagus nerve orchestrates the mind-body connection

#95

Post by aitchnyu »

conradev wrote: post #20
xyst wrote: post #9

Human body is very flawed. Damage to this nerve can result in systemic failure. When are we going to get an update? Evolution, pls fix!1

My favorite bugs are the ones that are too low priority to fix, like this one: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Photic_sneeze_reflex The exact pathophysiology is still unknown but it’s a variation on “the nose nerves and the optic nerve are too close together”

Also motion sickness. Food poisoning makes your brain experience phantom movements, hence its a trigger to purge the stomach. When your car/boat causes unexplained movement, ie your limbs didnt do and your eyes cannot track, time to soil your lap.

Re: The vagus nerve orchestrates the mind-body connection

#96

Post by evrimoztamur »

yunohn wrote: post #21
evrimoztamur wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a story about as long in text but not in duration. Nonetheless, I was unaware of a neck injury for about four years, then I got an MRI. Orthopedist suggested seeing a brain surgeon as soon as possible, and luckily the one I found suggested immediately that surgery for my young age was no option. I ended up getting corrective soles and a mouth guard, and with the mouth guard specifically, I immediately went fro…

This is very interesting, could you detail the connection between insoles and mouth guards to your neck/brain injury?

I had two herniated disks (T2/4) and one with a small fracture (T3). Clenching my jaw at night was leading to my SCM being tightened and applying pressure to the herniations, which was then causing imbalances in my upper back (which lead to the body correcting posture all the way down to your feet in a zig-zag manner) and also from my shoulder down to the wrist.

Mouth guard helps prevent too much pressure being applied to the neck, which gives pain relief all over.

As for soles, I had one foot that was facing outward while walking, which was identified by a physio to be due to hamstring tightness. But why is the hamstring tight? Automatic posture correction by my body! Since getting mouth guards, I've also been enjoying shoes with wide toeboxes and no rise too, which helped me correct my gait and reduce the impact on my hip.

Re: The vagus nerve orchestrates the mind-body connection

#97

Post by bolangi »

throaway827 wrote: post #84
jimiray wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Look up Polyvagal Theory by Stephen Porgess. https://www.stephenporges.com/

but is the polyvagal theory backed up by concrete scientific evidence? i’ve heard tons about it but practitioners never seem to have real statistics about it all. i thought that the polyvagal theory has never been actually proven?

Porges started with studying the difference in the length of successive heartbeats, and the nerve systems that control this variability. He accumulated lots of data, and published his findings. He looks at the function of the different branches of the vagus nerve before he eventually connects the state of the vagus nerve with the functioning of the social engagement mechanism--the system that enables us to recognize faces and read their emotional signals. He also connects the vagus nerve with fight-or-flight survival mode of the organism, vs. the rest-and-recuperate mode where resources are made available for healing. It is well-founded, plausible, has good explanatory power for how (to give one example) family visits to a hospitalized family member contribute so greatly to their recovery.

Re: The vagus nerve orchestrates the mind-body connection

#98

Post by adrian_b »

catoc wrote: post #18
ProllyInfamous wrote: post #3

I have extracted this (and other) nerves from cadavers, and this circuitous cranial nerve (XII?) is as beautiful and complex as the multibranch plexus -es (e.g. brachial ). So delicate. Human anatomy, at first glance, often seems wrongly-engineered. After you've worked inside dozens of people, you begin to realize that everybody is unique — and nobody is "textbook" anatomy. Who knows what all this goop even does?! If…

Nervus vagus is X - the tenth cranial nerve

And it was originally the last cranial nerve in vertebrates, before the first spinal nerves have been incorporated in the cranium as the nerves XI and XII.

It and several of the nerves preceding it, which originally innervated the branchial arches, remain different in nature from the following nerves (spinal nerves + cranial nerves XI and XII), whose original main purpose was to innervate the somatic muscles. This difference is more important than whether the nerves happen to exit the central nervous systems between adjacent vertebrae or by holes through the cranium (which are the result of the first vertebrae becoming fused to the occipital bone).

The nervus vagus and its associated ganglia of the vertebrates has a correspondent in the nervous system of most animals, including the arthropods, as a vegetative nervous system of the gastro-intestinal tract, which is connected to the central nervous system from the head, e.g. with the tritocerebrum of the arthropods.

Re: The vagus nerve orchestrates the mind-body connection

#99

Post by waste_monk »

ProllyInfamous wrote: post #62
burnte wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I know you’re exaggerating for poetic effect but this might actually be true in some parts of the human anatomy. I had an ingrown toenail fixed. There is a nerve that comes in and branches in two in the bug toe. In my toe it branches into three!

Even identical males twins don't have the same penis structure/routing. Thanks for sharing your own personal example (I am the twin, in mine). Another example is that of sciatia, which is much more prevalent when your sciatic nerve takes one particular path to get through the glutes. Other routed methods and sciatia is much less likely to be debilitating.

>Even identical males twins don't have the same penis structure/routing. Thanks for sharing your own personal example (I am the twin, in mine).

A form of biometric authentication, perhaps? Assume one has a spare CT scanner or some such thing, and doesn't mind discriminating against roughly half of the population.

Re: The vagus nerve orchestrates the mind-body connection

#100

Post by FeepingCreature »

Sysreq2 wrote: post #33
ProllyInfamous wrote: post #3

I have extracted this (and other) nerves from cadavers, and this circuitous cranial nerve (XII?) is as beautiful and complex as the multibranch plexus -es (e.g. brachial ). So delicate. Human anatomy, at first glance, often seems wrongly-engineered. After you've worked inside dozens of people, you begin to realize that everybody is unique — and nobody is "textbook" anatomy. Who knows what all this goop even does?! If…

This reminds me of a conversation I was having recently about genetically engineering humans. I think people are greatly underestimating the complexity of the human body and it’s nature mechanisms of adaptation. Everyone is a little different - but that’s okay because all the little feedback loops and receptor sites account for changes. Like a drug addict needing more and more to get their fix. There isn’t just one v…

Though arguably this should also make it easier to make changes, because the body already has to cope with so much natural variation.
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