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Brazilian court orders suspension of X

theguardian.com

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Re: Brazilian court orders suspension of X

#231

Post by consumer451 »

diegoholiveira wrote: post #100
consumer451 wrote: post #21

“Twitter doesn’t have a choice but to obey local governments. If we don’t obey local government laws, we will get shut down" - Elon Musk on decision to follow Modi's requests for censorship https://www.business-standard.com/technology/tech-news/twitt...

I don't know about India, but in Brazil, the requests sent to X (Twitter) have no legal basis, that is, they are illegal by nature. The entire process that resulted in this blocking is secret and not even the defense lawyers had access to the investigation.

I am not sure about India either, but according to my extensive legal training from looking at this wiki entry... it appears to be legal, yet probably unconstitutional.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Censorship_in_India

Re: Brazilian court orders suspension of X

#232

Post by hungie »

pcwalton wrote: post #205
hungie wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Right. The issue is not that Musk is putting his finger on the scale for the political right per se--it's his site and he has the right to do that. The issue is that he claims to be supporting "free speech" while doing so. To my knowledge, nobody at Twitter prior to Musk's takeover claimed the site was for "free speech".

Exactly.

Re: Brazilian court orders suspension of X

#233

Post by qwerpy »

jmclnx wrote: post #69

I am glad to see Brazil is not afraid of these billionaires. If only the US could start enforcing laws the same, no matter what your worth or who you are. I wonder if Brazil is finally going after corruption that I believe exists there. >“implement technological barriers to prevent the use of the X app by users of the iOS and Android systems” and to block the use of VPN applications. I wonder how they can selectivity…

I'm relieved that at least HN is pushing back on opinions like these. If you really want to be scared, look at the reddit threads discussing this on technology, worldnews, etc. The young online generation is more than happy to embrace authoritarianism and censorship as long as it hurts someone they dislike.

Re: Brazilian court orders suspension of X

#234

Post by yimmothathird »

qwerpy wrote: post #233
jmclnx wrote: post #69

I am glad to see Brazil is not afraid of these billionaires. If only the US could start enforcing laws the same, no matter what your worth or who you are. I wonder if Brazil is finally going after corruption that I believe exists there. >“implement technological barriers to prevent the use of the X app by users of the iOS and Android systems” and to block the use of VPN applications. I wonder how they can selectivity…

I'm relieved that at least HN is pushing back on opinions like these. If you really want to be scared, look at the reddit threads discussing this on technology, worldnews, etc. The young online generation is more than happy to embrace authoritarianism and censorship as long as it hurts someone they dislike.

When someone will embrace anything to harm you, you have to be prepared to weaponize the same things.

Re: Brazilian court orders suspension of X

#235

Post by basementcat »

theginger wrote: post #116

What starlink chooses to do will be most interesting, deny any connection, block X like the isps have been ordered and try and get their bank accounts reinstated. Or pull out of Brazil on the ground and operate as a rogue isp whose money can be blocked, in the short term at least but not their service. I hope it's the 2nd, be a lesson to all world leaders, and not just ultra authoritarian ones, that the Internet does…

Starlink cannot really operate as a "rogue ISP"; they have to license radio spectrum from Brazil and they have to share lawfully intercepted communications with Law Enforcement.

Re: Brazilian court orders suspension of X

#236

Post by throwaway87267 »

Zezinho wrote: post #211
throwaway87267 wrote: post #13

The same judge that is responsible for X's suspension ordered Apple and Google to take down VPN apps from their app stores as well. https://web.archive.org/web/20240830201851/https://www.conju... (Page 49 and 50, document is in Portuguese) Brazil is heading down a very dark path.

That's not what is written in the document. VPN apps are compelled to block access to X in Brazil.

CNN Brazil and Folha de S.Paulo both can back up my interpretation of the court order.

https://web.archive.org/web/20240830223541/https://www1.folh...

https://web.archive.org/web/20240830223743/https://www.cnnbr...

The specific section about removing VPNs from apps stores is quite unclear, I'll give you that, but factoring in how that section is structured, it's safe to say it's meant to be an order to remove VPNs from app stores.

Re: Brazilian court orders suspension of X

#237

Post by hereme888 »

hungie wrote: post #84
hereme888 wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's ridiculous. You think Elon Musk goes around reading people's tweets and deciding what he wants or not? Or trained an AI model to only allow content that suits him? The guy literally gets community-noted every once in a while. It's free speech.

Try saying "cisgender" on Twitter, of course the guy is moderating speech he personally doesn't like. It's not difficult to observe.

So Elon Musk getting community-noted is him moderating speech he doesn't like?

Re: Brazilian court orders suspension of X

#238

Post by [deleted] »

kgeist wrote: post #174
virgulino wrote: post #5

"People who use VPN to access X will be subject to daily fines of US$8,900" Edit: Thanks for this user https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41404325 for posting the court order and bringing this new information: Apple and Google must remove all VPN apps from their stores! Apple and Google must DELETE all VPN apps already installed on users' phones!!! https://apnews.com/article/brazil-musk-x-suspended-de-moraes...

Pretty hardcore even by the Russian standards. People aren't fined for using VPN here. That's some next level.

[deleted]

Re: Brazilian court orders suspension of X

#239

Post by hereme888 »

spinach wrote: post #132
hungie wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Try saying "cisgender" on Twitter, of course the guy is moderating speech he personally doesn't like. It's not difficult to observe.

[flagged]

They cared about left-speech, which is the only type of real free speech. Everything else is intolerance and must be banned, for the safety of everyone's emotions...or something like that.

Re: Brazilian court orders suspension of X

#240

Post by hagbard_c »

VerminOctopus1 wrote: post #197
mrtksn wrote: post #182

This is a very, very sad day for the Internet. Unfortunately, you can expect that every app and every platform will get localized and blocking will be normalized. Soon TikTok will be blocked in the USA. I expect this to serve as an example and an avalanche to follow across the globe. Blocking a platform for alleged crimes committed the by operator or participants is a punishment for all the users. It’s ridiculous but…

In this case was X not explicitly asked to remove the illegal content? They could have simply complied with the local law and avoided this outcome. With their hardcore engineers I’m sure they could have come up with a region-locked solution.

They might have been able to do so but they claim not to want to cooperate with what they consider to be a violation of both Brasilian law as well as their own ethical rules. Make of that what you will but it is a more defensible stance than bending to the will of whatever tyrant pops up even if it does not improve the bottom line.
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