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BMW Overtakes Tesla in European EV Sales for First Time

electriccarsreport.com

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Re: BMW Overtakes Tesla in European EV Sales for First Time

#201

Post by lotsofpulp »

primitivesuave wrote: post #149

In this particular case, it's worth the reminder that BMW's founder (Günther Quandt) was a strong financial supporter of the Nazi party, and his children (Herbert and Harald Quandt) enslaved tens of thousands of people in BMW factories before the collapse of Nazi Germany. I'm not trying to tell anyone to boycott BMW or Mercedes - just trying to add some historical context for those who instantly react to Tesla news w…

It’s not worth the reminder because one is dead and not relevant, whereas one is alive and influential.

Re: BMW Overtakes Tesla in European EV Sales for First Time

#202

Post by acdha »

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #168
the_gastropod wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Talk about a not accurate representation... > the Twitter acquisition followed a period of Twitter (and most other social media) banning a lot of conservative accounts for publishing truthful reporting (New York Post) The NY Post's Twitter has been banned multiple times, including the most recent one that happened in March 2023, well after Musk's takeover of the company. > or actual satire with the disfavored politic…

> The NY Post's Twitter has been banned multiple times They were, in particular, suspended immediately prior to the 2020 election over a story that was substantially accurate. > Twitter had terms of use. Everything has terms of use. All of the terms of use are purposely written so that anything the company wants can be construed as a violation. But also, "misgendering people" is a point of political dispute . "We pro…

> But also, "misgendering people" is a point of political dispute. "We prohibited the opposition's politics and then banned them for it" is in fact what they're objecting to.

You’re omitting that they had to make targeted attacks to be banned. You could talk in the abstract all day, as so many did, and never have a problem - it was only when they started targeting specific people who didn’t consent to some kind of debate. This is like going into a gay bar, yelling in some dude’s face that homosexuals are going to hell, and then whining about oppression when the bouncer tells you to leave.

Re: BMW Overtakes Tesla in European EV Sales for First Time

#203

Post by lern_too_spel »

throwadobe wrote: post #95
okr wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Was it not the mission of Tesla to make electrical cars an alternative to cars running on petrol? To me this was achieved. Bmw or Tesla, i do not care about that too much. But we have an alternative. Great! And politics, well, only for people who do not agree with him it is an issue. But that's normal in politics, is it not?

The mission of Tesla is to maximize value to its shareholders

Not quite. Tesla's mission is to do what its voting shareholders want. Usually, shareholders want to maximize their returns, but Tesla's shareholders voted to reduce their returns to overpay Musk for work already done.

Re: BMW Overtakes Tesla in European EV Sales for First Time

#204

Post by kanbara »

blackeyeblitzar wrote: post #166
jcranmer wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> a consequence of Elon's strong support. What strong support? I recall that Elon publicly announced he was going to do a massive contribution to Trump's campaign fund, and then he announced like two days later that he wasn't going to do it.

Must didn’t announce any kind of contribution to Trump. Various left leaning social media figures ran this misinformation, however, I assume in an attempt to galvanize their side into donating and to continue their unhinged attacks on Musk.

[flagged]

Re: BMW Overtakes Tesla in European EV Sales for First Time

#205

Post by kanbara »

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #143
marcosdumay wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But that's normal in politics, is it not? Excluding a part of the population for no practical reason at all is bad business. But when the politics becomes extremist, that share becomes huge, and it becomes disastrous business. Some people are motivated enough to lose business for their principles. But the guy's principles is "big business is right"... I'm not sure what he wants to achieve.

> Excluding a part of the population for no practical reason at all is bad business. But when the politics becomes extremist, that share becomes huge, and it becomes disastrous business. Companies do this all the time though. The trade off is, of course, that you get more support from customers the other side. > But the guy's principles is "big business is right"... I'm not sure what he wants to achieve. This is not…

he also disowned his daughter and treats her terribly, and generally supports pretty evil right wing personalities like chaya raichik. lots of reasons to dislike the man.

Re: BMW Overtakes Tesla in European EV Sales for First Time

#206

Post by tailrecursion »

foobazgt wrote: post #180
epistasis wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, Tesla's execution has been really terrible. There's some really good tech inside their cars, but the direction of which cars to make, when, and the investments in non-car tech, the over-promising of "Full Self Driving," etc. All huge detractors. There's also the CEO, who has a huge public profile, deciding to become extremely political, which smart CEOs usually avoid doing because it has little potential to help…

I don't really get this. "Love the art, not the artist" is pretty much an essentialism for participating in modern human society. Try taking a moment to trace through everything you consume and see how much of it was originated by very flawed human beings - some monstrously so. This extends in every direction, even all the way out to things like massive scientific discoveries. Nothing's immune, because we're all huma…

This appears to be downvoted, but why? I'd like to see the counterargument that we need to put each executive, author, director, or artist through a purity test before we can appreciate or purchase their work. How about listing a few pure American car CEOs.

Consumers are free to make choices based on anything they want: but whining in public about how some tweets affect your opinion on a car is not the same thing as privately making choices. This subject was opened for discussion and it remains open.

Re: BMW Overtakes Tesla in European EV Sales for First Time

#207

Post by kanbara »

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #168
the_gastropod wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Talk about a not accurate representation... > the Twitter acquisition followed a period of Twitter (and most other social media) banning a lot of conservative accounts for publishing truthful reporting (New York Post) The NY Post's Twitter has been banned multiple times, including the most recent one that happened in March 2023, well after Musk's takeover of the company. > or actual satire with the disfavored politic…

> The NY Post's Twitter has been banned multiple times They were, in particular, suspended immediately prior to the 2020 election over a story that was substantially accurate. > Twitter had terms of use. Everything has terms of use. All of the terms of use are purposely written so that anything the company wants can be construed as a violation. But also, "misgendering people" is a point of political dispute . "We pro…

wrong. it’s not political to disrespect someone’s identity. it’s the same as being racist. it wasn’t ok to support segregation, it’s not ok to support transphobia and banning medical care.

Re: BMW Overtakes Tesla in European EV Sales for First Time

#208

Post by ilrwbwrkhv »

coryrc wrote: post #186
ilrwbwrkhv wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was a really long term shareholder in Tesla. Like back when the Oatmeal made that famous Tesla comic strip. When he started calling people pedophiles on the internet and when I saw the board whose fiduciary duty is to keep the CEO in check do nothing, I exited my entire position. It is an absolute failure of the board that no one questions his dumb decisions of pandering to the right to save some taxes, when the ma…

TSLA price July 2018: $19.88 TSLA price today: $232.22 bad move

Guess where I put my exit cash? NVDA. There is always a better play.

Re: BMW Overtakes Tesla in European EV Sales for First Time

#209

Post by reducesuffering »

blackeyeblitzar wrote: post #166
jcranmer wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> a consequence of Elon's strong support. What strong support? I recall that Elon publicly announced he was going to do a massive contribution to Trump's campaign fund, and then he announced like two days later that he wasn't going to do it.

Must didn’t announce any kind of contribution to Trump. Various left leaning social media figures ran this misinformation, however, I assume in an attempt to galvanize their side into donating and to continue their unhinged attacks on Musk.

Yes, he did say he was contributing to a Trump PAC on his own Twitter: https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1815911188024225967

I guess you just ran your own misinformation.

Re: BMW Overtakes Tesla in European EV Sales for First Time

#210

Post by acdha »

blackeyeblitzar wrote: post #166
jcranmer wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> a consequence of Elon's strong support. What strong support? I recall that Elon publicly announced he was going to do a massive contribution to Trump's campaign fund, and then he announced like two days later that he wasn't going to do it.

Must didn’t announce any kind of contribution to Trump. Various left leaning social media figures ran this misinformation, however, I assume in an attempt to galvanize their side into donating and to continue their unhinged attacks on Musk.

The Wall Street Journal is hardly left-leaning, and they were the source of the story:

https://www.wsj.com/politics/elections/elon-musk-has-said-he...

… and you might want to check with the source before saying he didn’t announce anything:

https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1815911188024225967

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