For advertising, Firefox now collects user data by default • Hacker News Board

Re: For advertising, Firefox now collects user data by default

#131

Post by suby » Tue, Jul 16, 2024, 10:24 AM UTC

different_base wrote: post #69

Ygg2 wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why Ladybird? Why not Servo?

I appreciate Ladybird's initiative. But if they work with Servo, Ladybird can build the browser and Servo can focus on the engine. Also we can avoid C++ nightmare. Everybody wins.

Ladybird seems to have more momentum and be further along in development in my testing of visiting random websites. This may or may not have something to do with developer velocity of each language, genuinely I don't know but I think it's worth considering.

Regardless, from what I've gathered, Ladybird is going to ship of theseus their way into memory safety. It's not announced what the C++ replacement language will be, but they are working towards that.

Re: For advertising, Firefox now collects user data by default

#132

Post by bondarchuk » Tue, Jul 16, 2024, 10:24 AM UTC

Piraty wrote: post #113

If 1% of regular Firefox users just donated the equivalent of 10USD per year to mozilla, they would not have the need to find ...eyebrow-raising... ways to earn money.

Only if they'd also spin off the browser from all the political activism and NGO cash grabbing, and let people choose themselves to which of the two their money goes.

Re: For advertising, Firefox now collects user data by default

#133

Post by quaintdev » Tue, Jul 16, 2024, 10:27 AM UTC

tgv wrote: post #104

DaoVeles wrote: post #31

So where can I donate to Ladybird browser development? Before anyone tries to respond with it. It is https://donorbox.org/ladybird

Don't hold your breath. It takes ages to develop a browser that's as fast as Firefox. CSS and JS are no joke.

Maybe it's time to move away from whole html/css/js, http and browsers?

Let's build something that is Ad resistant from the start. Something that uses native technologies.

Edit: We need something that does not need backing of large corporations or huge funding to access the web.

Internet was always simple. We have become over dependent on browsers and http stack.

Re: For advertising, Firefox now collects user data by default

#134

Post by uyzstvqs » Tue, Jul 16, 2024, 10:27 AM UTC

What's dumb is that Firefox is not the freedom browser people think it is. Mozilla is a crappy organization. Firefox has extension signing, it's as restrictive as installing apps on iOS where only approved apps can be installed, without a setting to easily disable it. Mozilla can also remotely install extensions by default (opt out) called "experiments" or something. Their anti-tracking is purposefully weak because of their dealings with Google. Now this data collection for ads. They didn't enable DNS-over-HTTPS by default specifically in the UK. And Mozilla leadership is associated with radical left politics, just as an extra.

Maybe check out Brave Browser, LibreWolf or Vivaldi.

Re: For advertising, Firefox now collects user data by default

#135

Post by DoItToMe81 » Tue, Jul 16, 2024, 10:27 AM UTC

lopis wrote: post #84

rwmj wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> leading to a perpetual arms race that we may not win So we're not even going to try.

This is an attempt to try. You don't win my being an immovable wall going against the biggest corporations. If the W3C manages to create a system that satisfies advertisers while preserving our privacy, that's how you win. There isn't a future where advertising will just disappear. I'm just being pragmatic here, as a user of ad blockers for 15 years.

It's not an attempt to try, it's reputation management. There is no 'anonymization' of data, because the advertising companies Mozilla is selling your data to now have almost 20 years of profiling that can effectively identify people through "anonymous" results. This has been known for years. Mozilla knows. They don't care.

Re: For advertising, Firefox now collects user data by default

#136

Post by david_draco » Tue, Jul 16, 2024, 10:28 AM UTC

latexr wrote: post #87

eco wrote: post #17

The CTO of Mozilla just posted on /r/firefox about this: https://old.reddit.com/r/firefox/comments/1e43w7v/a_word_abo...

> It’s clear in retrospect that we should have communicated more on this one What isn’t clear, in retrospect or otherwise, is why companies/apps/services need to keep learning this lesson. The user outcry was utterly predictable from even before the first web article was out. The fact that no one with decision power at Mozilla saw it coming is worrying: either they have zero understanding of people’s concerns for pri…

> What isn’t clear, in retrospect or otherwise, is why companies/apps/services need to keep learning this lesson.

They are trying to find a funding model that makes them independent from Google.

- Building a fast, privacy-oriented browser that keeps up with web standards and fixes security bugs takes people, organisation and therefore money. Yes, much more than that CEO salary.

- No one wants to buy for a browser.

- No one wants to pay a subscription fee for a browser.

So you are left with ads. Mozilla is trying to find a balance there between privacy and ads with a clearing house approach. People who hate ads out of principle scream. How should browser development be funded?

Re: For advertising, Firefox now collects user data by default

#137

Post by ManBeardPc » Tue, Jul 16, 2024, 10:31 AM UTC

Maybe I don't fully understand the technical implementation, but as far as I have read about the implementation this gives personal information to a third-party. This should automatically mean that Firefox would violate European GDPR laws, they clearly need to get consent from the user before collecting anything. Not just a moral issue, but can quickly become a legal one as well.

Re: For advertising, Firefox now collects user data by default

#138

Post by tda » Tue, Jul 16, 2024, 10:31 AM UTC

fransje26 wrote: post #88

tda wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

on firefox mobile: open chrome://geckoview/content/config.xhtml, set general.aboutConfig.enable to true open about:config, set dom.private-attribution.submission.enabled to false

What's the difference with setting dom.private-attribution.submission.enabled to false in the gekoview?

Probably none, I didn't know it was also there. I just compiled what worked for me after scrolling through a few other posts.

Re: For advertising, Firefox now collects user data by default

#139

Post by latexr » Tue, Jul 16, 2024, 10:31 AM UTC

cqqxo4zV46cp wrote: post #116

Klonoar wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The fact that no one with decision power at Mozilla saw it coming is worrying: either they have zero understanding of people’s concerns for privacy or they don’t care. Or the third option: they feel the tradeoff of HN & co's criticism style is not a big deal in the end. Criticism of Mozilla in general is very warranted right now, but the way(s) in which everyone is doing so just feels very out of touch with the act…

[flagged]

That is incredibly reductive and entirely misses the scope of the issue. It isn’t just HN. In case you’ve missed it, the article is not an HN page but a separate website. The comment I replied to linked to Reddit. It’s all over Mastodon. I’ve seen other blogs and publications commenting on it too.

Yes, of course a large number of people won’t talk about this in six weeks, let alone six months. On the other hand you’ll have ex-hardcore fans complaining about it for over six years. I still see people talking about the Mr Robot debacle and the other crap Mozilla has pulled to this day. If anything, Mozilla is more susceptible to this backlash than the average tech company. Regular computer users don’t give a rat’s ass about Firefox. The people Mozilla needs to convince are exactly the ones they keep alienating.

Re: For advertising, Firefox now collects user data by default

#140

Post by jeltz » Tue, Jul 16, 2024, 10:31 AM UTC

cqqxo4zV46cp wrote: post #116

Klonoar wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The fact that no one with decision power at Mozilla saw it coming is worrying: either they have zero understanding of people’s concerns for privacy or they don’t care. Or the third option: they feel the tradeoff of HN & co's criticism style is not a big deal in the end. Criticism of Mozilla in general is very warranted right now, but the way(s) in which everyone is doing so just feels very out of touch with the act…

[flagged]

They might be correct but this thinking is also how Mozilla lost most of their German market share due to Cliqz. They assumed people would not care but they did. Also this is trending on /r/all on Reddit right now.

https://www.reddit.com/r/pcmasterrace/comments/1e45mih/firef...