Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Apple Vision Pro U.S. Sales Are All but Dead, Market Analysts Say

gizmodo.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

131–140 of 223 posts

Re: Apple Vision Pro U.S. Sales Are All but Dead, Market Analysts Say

#131

Post by Shawnj2 »

anakaine wrote: post #93
zamadatix wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think the price itself is the root problem. I mean don't get me wrong if it were $350 it'd sell a lot more than $3,500 but the point is it still wouldn't sell well anyways so why only ever talk about how it costs a lot. To me the problem with the Vision line is it doesn't give any compelling reason to want it now or in the imminent future, even if it were priced similarly to lower end headsets, to really driv…

When the price is higher than many people's average monthly post tax income, and its not a must have device like a fridge or washing machine, it's definitely a pricing problem. In 2022 the US median personal income was $47,000. That's pre tax. Consider approximations with averages and marginal tax rates and take out 12% for tax, and you have $3445 per month median personal income. The apple headset is $3500. Take out…

AVP is incredibly expensive but Meta makes a consumer friendly budget option for $500 and that’s not selling crazy well either.

Re: Apple Vision Pro U.S. Sales Are All but Dead, Market Analysts Say

#132

Post by duped »

lurking_swe wrote: post #106
autoexecbat wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd happily buy one for $500, but $3500 is way too much

considering it has a CPU that is as powerful as the MacBook Pro, I find your target price extremely optimistic. hopefully once the display tech becomes cheaper, the overall price will come down quite a bit. But $500? unrealistic expectations IMO. Maybe in 10 years.

$500 is what a new gaming console costs. If Apple wants to compete for the attention of people with better gaming/entertainment experiences then their price needs to come down.

I think it's unrealistic of Apple to expect sales for more than $500, and the market has proven that to be correct.

Re: Apple Vision Pro U.S. Sales Are All but Dead, Market Analysts Say

#133

Post by CivBase »

jonwinstanley wrote: post #61
haunter wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>maybe I'm missing something obvious here. It's an expensive gadget for a niche [0] market. $3500 is an incredibly high price for what it is. 0, https://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/ 1.75% of Steam users have a VR headset as of June this year which is lower than the people who are using Linux for gaming (2.08%). So you can see how small the VR market is. And the top alternatives are $500 (Quest 3) and $1000 (Valve…

Exactly. Revisit this stat in a couple of years once we are all talking about Vision Pro v3? This product is going to take a while to a) get good and b) go mainstream

I think it's pretty optimistic to expect either of those will be realized in a couple of years. If Apple does release a v3 in that time (big if), I'm doubtful it will amount to more than a minor iteration on the first gen model. I think Apple is probably happy to let this stay a niche product with a very slow release cadence.

After all, why would they release a v2 next year? What significant improvements could they make in that time that would entice new customers - or entice existing customers to upgrade?

The MacBook is a work device used by many professionals and can easily be justified as a recurring business expense. The iPhone is a relatively cheap device whose sales are bolstered by affordable payment plans offered by US carriers. These devices sell in huge volumes and it makes sense for people upgrade them often, so there's a lot of money to be had in frequent iterative releases. That's just not the case with the Vision Pro.

If Apple releases a new Vision Pro, it will need to be a big upgrade - or a cost-down model with a more accessible price point.

Re: Apple Vision Pro U.S. Sales Are All but Dead, Market Analysts Say

#134

Post by crazygringo »

adastra22 wrote: post #124
crazygringo wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you have lower back pain from sitting in a chair with bad posture for decades, it's a godsend. When you're "in the zone" programming on a screen or writing a book or editing a movie, it's not like you're particularly aware of your environment anyways. And like I said -- not building up the lower back problems that will haunt you later in life.

I already work reclined. But not strapped into goggles that isolate me from my environment and the people around me.

Then you know how crazy expensive it is to have to mount one or more monitors above you, hanging from some kind of support.

And like I said, isolation while working is actually kind of a feature, when you're deep in productive work. Just think of all the people who wear noise-cancelling headphones in offices to tune out the distracting environment.

I don't want to use it for video calls or while multitasking, but for serious work I want to be isolated -- that's a feature not a bug. And passthru is a kind of nice in-between mode.

Re: Apple Vision Pro U.S. Sales Are All but Dead, Market Analysts Say

#135

Post by tomwojcik »

Sir_Twist wrote: post #35

I wonder whether the behavior Apple has exhibited around their developer relations (especially their EU / notorization related troubles) has had a chilling effect on people's willingness to support a new platform like this. Without the raw number of users that something like the iPhone has, does Apple make it worthwhile to create apps / games for their platforms? I'm not a developer, so maybe there is a more technica…

I used to work in game dev ~9 years ago. iPhone is where the users are, so naturally that's your main target. But your game will accomplish success only if you're featured in the app store (I don't own apple so this might have changed drastically). But in order to get featured...

Haptic feedback in the newest iphone? You need to support it in order to be featured.

You can play games on apple watch? If you support it, a guaranteed feature.

New localisation guidelines? Featured only if you support all of them.

So back then (not sure how it is right now) you needed to implement useless or at the very least something unnecessary in order to be featured on iPhone and make a buck. Otherwise apple wasn't able to sell their new technologies.

If nothing has changed, people will try to port their games to apple vr so they are more likely to be featured on iPhone.

All our games (6, iirc), were featured.

Re: Apple Vision Pro U.S. Sales Are All but Dead, Market Analysts Say

#136

Post by al_borland »

I'm interested, but am waiting for v2 or v3. At this point it's already been out for 6 months, so what's another 6 months in hopes of a smaller/lighter version with a slightly lower price point, not to mention more apps and content. Reviews haven't been strong enough to make me think I'm missing out on much with the v1.

Re: Apple Vision Pro U.S. Sales Are All but Dead, Market Analysts Say

#137

Post by hu3 »

JoshTriplett wrote: post #71
hu3 wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> ship a bug that allows OS jailbreak to run VMs Apple lacks that courage

To do it intentionally, sure, but don't worry, it'll happen whether they intend it or not.

I highly doubt.

They don't even allow emulators in iOS.

It took EU a decade to make Apple allow third party stores and even then Apple hasn't really complied still.

Same for browser engines.

Re: Apple Vision Pro U.S. Sales Are All but Dead, Market Analysts Say

#138

Post by zamadatix »

schmidtleonard wrote: post #104
jonwinstanley wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. Revisit this stat in a couple of years once we are all talking about Vision Pro v3? This product is going to take a while to a) get good and b) go mainstream

"It's a dev kit for those willing to spend on early access to Apple's AR/VR ecosystem" was always the sane take, it was really weird watching so many people convince themselves that it was a mass-market product and then convince themselves that the failure of a mass-market audience to materialize was some kind of a disaster. I have no visibility inside Apple so I don't know if they drank their own kool-aid on this on…

Apple has no problems clearly announcing dev kits as dev kits, just look at the Developer Transition Kit hardware they released for the PowerPC->Intel and Intel->Apple Silicon transitions. These kinds of things are not only clearly labeled as dev kits they have required paying to join dedicated dev kit programs which expressly forbid getting the (loaned, not bought) device for non-porting or non-development related work. Apple Vision Pro was nothing like that, it had consumer focused announcements at consumer focused events, had consumer ads, sold through the normal consumer channels, and used standard consumer accounts.

The other thing that doesn't line up with this take is how Apple announcing they've cancelled the next Vision Pro to work on a lower cost version is squared up. Even if you still take the Vision Pro as having always been intended a dev kit for early access, needing to cancel the follow on model development to rescope to a lower end product for the market is no less a miss than the initial launch in that the entire program was completely misaligned with the market until well after launch.

I think half of the news stories are a result of Apple pushing this to release to market instead of just shuttering the version internally and the other half are a result of a launch problem like this being relatively rare for the most valuable company in the world and not necessarily about viewing the product itself with blinders.

Re: Apple Vision Pro U.S. Sales Are All but Dead, Market Analysts Say

#139

Post by gizajob »

al_borland wrote: post #130
hunterclarke wrote: post #31

I was in an Apple Store the other day for something unrelated. While waiting, I asked one of the employees if I should try the AVP. Their response was "it's cool I guess. Probably not worth the effort." Pretty telling.

Wow, it sounds like the quality of employees at the Apple Store has really taken a nose dive. I could never imagine anyone who worked there saying something like that in the past.

They’ve been virtually McDonald’s-level for years now.

Re: Apple Vision Pro U.S. Sales Are All but Dead, Market Analysts Say

#140

Post by tomwojcik »

tomwojcik wrote: post #135
Sir_Twist wrote: post #35

I wonder whether the behavior Apple has exhibited around their developer relations (especially their EU / notorization related troubles) has had a chilling effect on people's willingness to support a new platform like this. Without the raw number of users that something like the iPhone has, does Apple make it worthwhile to create apps / games for their platforms? I'm not a developer, so maybe there is a more technica…

I used to work in game dev ~9 years ago. iPhone is where the users are, so naturally that's your main target. But your game will accomplish success only if you're featured in the app store (I don't own apple so this might have changed drastically). But in order to get featured... Haptic feedback in the newest iphone? You need to support it in order to be featured. You can play games on apple watch? If you support it,…

I can't seem to be able to edit. My wording was incorrect. It was not needed to implement all those useless features to get your game featured in the store, but very helpful. And it makes sense, imo.
Post reply on HN