Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Apple Vision Pro U.S. Sales Are All but Dead, Market Analysts Say

gizmodo.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

51–60 of 223 posts

Re: Apple Vision Pro U.S. Sales Are All but Dead, Market Analysts Say

#51

Post by wrsh07 »

ProfessorLayton wrote: post #23

"...analysts have noted that many who bought one were confused by its more complicated setup and what they were supposed to use it for in their daily lives." There's the root of the problem right there. Apple's best successes had a very clear purpose in mind from the beginning: - iPod: 1,000 songs in your pocket - iPhone: A phone, an internet communicator, an iPod - iPad: Media consumption AVP didn't have a clear pur…

I'm not sure that's right. Apple launched the watch thinking "apps like iphone"

A few versions in, they settled on "watches are for health and fitness"

Ben Thompson discusses the AVP as an immersive iPad, and that's kind of the problem. It's too locked down to be my productivity device (something that could justifiably command a premium price), and my entertainment budget isn't that high for one person (I already have a tv in that price range - cheaper tbh - that's really really good)

Re: Apple Vision Pro U.S. Sales Are All but Dead, Market Analysts Say

#52

Post by pjmlp »

Anyone that has been following VR/AR headsets for the last 30 years was already expecting this.

How come does Apple come to a market that was already going down, pretending that Quest and HoloLens never did developer sessions showing exactly the same kind of content, a decade ago?

To make matters worse, their current attitude that developers should feel grateful and blessed to even be able to touch their SDKs, means that very few feel like targeting a device that costs as much as it does.

Re: Apple Vision Pro U.S. Sales Are All but Dead, Market Analysts Say

#53

Post by nottorp »

> Sales expectations will put even more pressure on Apple engineers to design something that can compete with devices like the $500 Meta Quest 3 while justifying the higher price tag.

... and it's not like the oculus thingies have sold in the billions. VR still has no killer app.

Re: Apple Vision Pro U.S. Sales Are All but Dead, Market Analysts Say

#54

Post by LordKeren »

Sir_Twist wrote: post #35

I wonder whether the behavior Apple has exhibited around their developer relations (especially their EU / notorization related troubles) has had a chilling effect on people's willingness to support a new platform like this. Without the raw number of users that something like the iPhone has, does Apple make it worthwhile to create apps / games for their platforms? I'm not a developer, so maybe there is a more technica…

Apple has definitely, definitely soured their relationships with third party developers— but I think the far larger issue is the install base. There isn’t enough AVPs sold to ever recoup the cost of developing a VisionOS native application.

There are also effectively 0 well qualified developers for VisionOS — it’s so new that no one outside Apple has a significant amount of experience. So even beyond pure build hours alone, getting an application launched on the platform is a non-trivial amount of developer training.

Re: Apple Vision Pro U.S. Sales Are All but Dead, Market Analysts Say

#55

Post by elicash »

ProfessorLayton wrote: post #23

"...analysts have noted that many who bought one were confused by its more complicated setup and what they were supposed to use it for in their daily lives." There's the root of the problem right there. Apple's best successes had a very clear purpose in mind from the beginning: - iPod: 1,000 songs in your pocket - iPhone: A phone, an internet communicator, an iPod - iPad: Media consumption AVP didn't have a clear pur…

I think Apple gave it a clear purpose: productivity and media. Basically, it's a giant screen anywhere you go.

It's just not that useful, or alternatively way too expensive. But I think they communicated their theory pretty well.

Re: Apple Vision Pro U.S. Sales Are All but Dead, Market Analysts Say

#56

Post by jmspring »

Sir_Twist wrote: post #35

I wonder whether the behavior Apple has exhibited around their developer relations (especially their EU / notorization related troubles) has had a chilling effect on people's willingness to support a new platform like this. Without the raw number of users that something like the iPhone has, does Apple make it worthwhile to create apps / games for their platforms? I'm not a developer, so maybe there is a more technica…

Apple’s issues with the EU/etc have nothing to do with it.

Apple has a hard core base market. That said, the Vision Pro/headset market is small and Apple is only really going to get the Apple fanboy portion of that.

Re: Apple Vision Pro U.S. Sales Are All but Dead, Market Analysts Say

#57

Post by mjamesaustin »

nox101 wrote: post #8
snapcaster wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, I want to like mine and use it more but the software support is the real problem. The hardware is truly amazing (ignoring price point) and i've never had a VR/AR experience anywhere close but doing anything like my current computer flow is such a pain

> i've never had a VR/AR experience anywhere close What VR experiences have you had? I was not impressed at all. Have had a Rift since they launched. Rift-S, Quest 2, Quest 3, PSVR, PSVR2. Nothing about the Vision Pro did anything for me. The "try to hold your eyes still to point" is the worst possible UX interaction I've ever used. Super un-natural and un-intuitive. That's not how my eyes work. I knew that the first…

I've got a Quest 3 and I have to say I thought the Vision Pro interface was about 100x better. Windows stay concretely fixed in place (instead of skittering and jittering about), and the interaction paradigm required no training and worked flawlessly for me. Every time I pick up my Quest now, I feel the disappointment of having to use a controller or the terrible hand tracking.

Re: Apple Vision Pro U.S. Sales Are All but Dead, Market Analysts Say

#58

Post by snapcaster »

nox101 wrote: post #8
snapcaster wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, I want to like mine and use it more but the software support is the real problem. The hardware is truly amazing (ignoring price point) and i've never had a VR/AR experience anywhere close but doing anything like my current computer flow is such a pain

> i've never had a VR/AR experience anywhere close What VR experiences have you had? I was not impressed at all. Have had a Rift since they launched. Rift-S, Quest 2, Quest 3, PSVR, PSVR2. Nothing about the Vision Pro did anything for me. The "try to hold your eyes still to point" is the worst possible UX interaction I've ever used. Super un-natural and un-intuitive. That's not how my eyes work. I knew that the first…

Also if you're having fit/weight issues worth switching to the extra strap they ship and investing a good amount of time trying to optimize it. I did that and now wearing it for 8 hour stretches isn't a big deal. YMMV

Re: Apple Vision Pro U.S. Sales Are All but Dead, Market Analysts Say

#59

Post by bastien2 »

Sir_Twist wrote: post #35

I wonder whether the behavior Apple has exhibited around their developer relations (especially their EU / notorization related troubles) has had a chilling effect on people's willingness to support a new platform like this. Without the raw number of users that something like the iPhone has, does Apple make it worthwhile to create apps / games for their platforms? I'm not a developer, so maybe there is a more technica…

It's more that VR/AR is a high-cost solution still in search of a problem that makes it profitable.

So far the only market for VR is niche entertainment. VRC is fun, but VR games have been arounds for decades and never gotten past novelty.

AR has value as an accessibility tool because it can get around the high cost of some infrastructure changes. But like all accessibility tools, profit-focused eyeballs see it as a small, low-margin market. Enabling human rights is not considered profit.

Re: Apple Vision Pro U.S. Sales Are All but Dead, Market Analysts Say

#60

Post by TulliusCicero »

haunter wrote: post #41
Sir_Twist wrote: post #35

I wonder whether the behavior Apple has exhibited around their developer relations (especially their EU / notorization related troubles) has had a chilling effect on people's willingness to support a new platform like this. Without the raw number of users that something like the iPhone has, does Apple make it worthwhile to create apps / games for their platforms? I'm not a developer, so maybe there is a more technica…

>maybe I'm missing something obvious here. It's an expensive gadget for a niche [0] market. $3500 is an incredibly high price for what it is. 0, https://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/ 1.75% of Steam users have a VR headset as of June this year which is lower than the people who are using Linux for gaming (2.08%). So you can see how small the VR market is. And the top alternatives are $500 (Quest 3) and $1000 (Valve…

Linux for gaming presumably includes the Steam Deck, no?
Post reply on HN