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Neal Stephenson wants to revolutionize sword fighting video games

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Re: Neal Stephenson wants to revolutionize sword fighting video games

#131

Post by gmurphy »

znt wrote: post #21
psykotic wrote: post #5

Anyone remember Die by the Sword? Admittedly it was more sword flailing than sword fighting, but it's the only game I've played that had a semblance of direct control. It was also the first game to use IK for everything from sword fighting to rope swinging and ladder climbing. Even nowadays it's rare to see IK used in games for anything except relatively minor pose fix-ups (blending canned poses offers better control…

You should try out Mount & Blade series then.

While Mount and Blade is one of my favorite games of all time, its sword fighting is pretty different to the simulation in Die by the Sword. DbtS didn't really have pre-programmed motions like M&B, it instead attempted to map 2D mouse position to 3D hand position using a physical model of the player's skeleton (which generally resulted in flailing madly with your arm contorted into bonkers positions for the first week of play).

Re: Neal Stephenson wants to revolutionize sword fighting video games

#133

Post by rd108 »

antipax wrote: post #6

Biggest problem with these games (I've found, anyway) is that your sword controller cannot magically stop in mid air when your virtual sword hits another sword or a wall or whatever. It really ruins the immersion.

wonder if you can use a gyroscope to add some of this effect....

Re: Neal Stephenson wants to revolutionize sword fighting video games

#134

Post by uvTwitch »

x1 wrote: post #2

He's been wanting this since the mid-90's - not downplaying or being snarky, just making a point. This reminds me of Hero in Snow Crash.

My first thought was "okay so it looks like Neal is pretending to be Hiro or something"

...I'm okay with this.

Re: Neal Stephenson wants to revolutionize sword fighting video games

#136

Post by josephkern »

defen wrote: post #61
dfc wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the average video gamer is significantly less fit than the average medieval soldier. I am curious if this is just speculation or if you have evidence for this statement? At first it seems reasonable but I am not so confident after you factor in modern medicine and advances in nutrition/diet and discount for stereotyping.

Consider the draw weight of the longbow - "Although the draw weight of a typical English longbow is disputed, it was at least 360 newtons (81 pounds-force) and possibly more than 600 N (130 lbf), with some estimates as high as 900 N (200 lbf)". And they would loose approximately 6 arrows per minute in combat. And this was a weapon for the yeomanry, not the guys whose entire lives were devoted to maintaining military…

> And this was a weapon for the yeomanry, not the guys whose entire lives were devoted to maintaining military prowess.

Yes in fact they did spend their whole lives practicing. (From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_longbow#Training):

"Longbows were very difficult to master because the force required to deliver an arrow through the improving armour of medieval Europe was very high by modern standards ... etons of longbow archers are recognisably deformed, with enlarged left arms and often bone spurs on left wrists, left shoulders and right fingers."

Further:

"It was the difficulty in using the longbow which led various monarchs of England to issue instructions encouraging their ownership and practice, including the Assize of Arms of 1252 and King Edward III's declaration of 1363."

The popularization of the crossbow, in part, was the reduceded need for training. In some areas it also paid better.

Re: Neal Stephenson wants to revolutionize sword fighting video games

#137

Post by goblin89 »

twelvechairs wrote: post #96
yummyfajitas wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It will also have to drastically downplay the importance of footwork. In a real swordfight, where to put your feet is nearly as important as where to put the sword.

This is why I don't like games talking about how 'realistic' they will be. Firstly, because anything that runs on a standard computer will be far from reality anyway, and secondly because often users don't actually want reality (eg. most FPSs have far from realistic walking speeds - for good reason. Also stylised graphics etc.). That said, the concept of different styles of swordplay is great - and having more 'reali…

It's interesting to note that in GTA IV (not exactly an FPS, though) gameplay appears to be slowed down quite a bit compared to previous games in the series. Probably that's facilitated by more realistic graphics, with many little details to entertain our brain while the character gets out of the car.

Re: Neal Stephenson wants to revolutionize sword fighting video games

#138

Post by jvrossb »

antipax wrote: post #6

Biggest problem with these games (I've found, anyway) is that your sword controller cannot magically stop in mid air when your virtual sword hits another sword or a wall or whatever. It really ruins the immersion.

I'm surprised no one has mentioned haptics in this thread. Novint for example produces commercial haptic controllers. Haptics are what can get your controller to magically stop mid-air.

Re: Neal Stephenson wants to revolutionize sword fighting video games

#139

Post by goblin89 »

saulrh wrote: post #47
dfc wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the average video gamer is significantly less fit than the average medieval soldier. I am curious if this is just speculation or if you have evidence for this statement? At first it seems reasonable but I am not so confident after you factor in modern medicine and advances in nutrition/diet and discount for stereotyping.

Bit of a difference between overall health and sword-swinging fitness. I may be almost completely disease- and parasite-free, but the guy that's been training five hours a day since he was five will always lift more than me and run further than me.

Does “overall health” mean being disease- and parasite-free, though? There's at least one disease I heard of from which the case may actually benefit with increased lifespan[0]. That said, I tend to agree that to equate fitness with health probably isn't correct either.

[0] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Celiac_disease#Screening

Re: Neal Stephenson wants to revolutionize sword fighting video games

#140

Post by JabavuAdams »

brianobush wrote: post #94
antipax wrote: post #6

Biggest problem with these games (I've found, anyway) is that your sword controller cannot magically stop in mid air when your virtual sword hits another sword or a wall or whatever. It really ruins the immersion.

my approach to realistic fighting is: go to kendo keiko as often as possible. even the bruises seem real.

Kendo's pretty far from realistic fighting. The fact that it's a contact sport is cool, though.
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