Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

It's getting harder to die

plough.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

21–30 of 255 posts

Re: It's getting harder to die

#21

Post by onlypassingthru »

complaintdept wrote: post #6
Modified3019 wrote: post #2

The topic of a “living will” came up in a family discussion after my mother’s funeral. None of us have a pathological desire to live at all costs, but as it turns out, figuring out when to say “yeah I’m done, see yah” and halt treatment is way more complex than it first seems, especially when making the decision for someone else. Things can happen very fast, and there’s a bunch of things that basically require a job…

Talk to an estate attorney and they can give you some advice, but ultimately you'll never be able to account for every possibility, and you're going to have to trust somebody to make the right decisions for you at some point.

Anecdotally, a family friend was barely clinging on to life for a couple weeks enduring heavy pain meds and abject misery. Only when his close friend, and executor of his estate, sat beside him and told him everything was going to be alright did he finally find peace and let go. He was gone within 30 minutes.

Re: It's getting harder to die

#22

Post by briffle »

vundercind wrote: post #11

Recently watched someone close die over a couple days, after a long decline. The last 24 hours were monstrous to inflict on anyone. Torture. Evil. Hours and hours of faltering breathing, often restarting with what was plainly a panicked adrenaline-pumping response. It looked like they felt like they were about to drown every few minutes , hour, after hour, no relief. No IV fluids (terminal anyway, so no trying to kee…

> and unable to drink, so certainly terribly thirsty the whole time.

I know people that work in hospice, and they say this is a big misconception (the article hints at it too). they patients don't die from lack of water, they don't want water because they are dying, and their body can't process it. In fact, as you kind of touched on at the start, giving them IV fluids can cause them to drown since their body can't process the water.

Death is pretty ugly thing, that comes for us all. I got to learn the fun way that in the state of Oregon, it is illegal to disable a pacemaker. Even when the person has a DNR, and it is really the only thing keeping them alive. The best the doctors can do is turn the pacemaker down as low as possible, and hope its not enough to keep the person artificially alive. Which seems kind of really weird, when its also the first and one of the only states that allows medically assisted suicide..

Re: It's getting harder to die

#23

Post by nsguy »

ericmcer wrote: post #3

Kind of a tough read, I just turned 37 and this was the year when it really hit home that your body degrades and sometimes it never goes back to "normal". I was used to sports injuries being a pattern of injury -> recovery -> ramp back up to 100%, but have suffered some injuries recently and am coming to terms with realizing I will never return to 100%. They will be lingering things I deal with for the rest of my lif…

I'm a fair bit older than you... What you're saying is true but it's also worth mentioning your body has capabilities you're probably far from reaching. Most people your age can still exceed any physical accomplishment they've had in their lifetime if they really want to. E.g. they can play sports better than they ever had and they can achieve personal bests in any physical ability. If you were a top level professional athlete that's probably not true (though even professional athletes have longer careers than they used to) or if you've been a top 10 GM in chess than that's probably behind you too, but otherwise you're young!

I don't know what specific injuries you're suffering from but I've suffered from back pain and really improved my situation a lot. I'm physically stronger than I've ever been in my life. I've worked through some knee injuries. I've even recently improved my gum health (in a way someone said wasn't possible). It takes more work and more focus but our bodies are amazing machines and 37 ain't old.

Re: It's getting harder to die

#24

Post by lurking_swe »

spurgu wrote: post #17
vundercind wrote: post #11

Recently watched someone close die over a couple days, after a long decline. The last 24 hours were monstrous to inflict on anyone. Torture. Evil. Hours and hours of faltering breathing, often restarting with what was plainly a panicked adrenaline-pumping response. It looked like they felt like they were about to drown every few minutes , hour, after hour, no relief. No IV fluids (terminal anyway, so no trying to kee…

I'm sorry for your loss. Edit: I feel a bit dumb now, I hadn't actually read the article yet, went straight for the comments. Seems like I'm just reiterating what it says. When I'm in that shape I just wanna go in peace. Preferably at home, in my own bed, surrounded by loved ones. No tubes down my throat, no shots to keep me alive at any cost, with no end in sight. Here's some good discussion on the topic between two…

The problem with this perspective in my opinion is that many times, especially for an elderly person, a small emergency can very quickly escalate into a life and death situation, and the outcome is not clear until it’s too late. you may enter the hospital thinking you have a decent outcome, but you end up with a bad outcome.

for example, nobody plans to go on a ventilator. But if you need one (like severe pneumonia), you’re already pretty messed up and you’re going to have a painful death with or without the tubes.

Re: It's getting harder to die

#25

Post by paxys »

Regular reminder to read Being Mortal: Medicine and What Matters in the End by Atul Gawande. It offers a detailed and sometimes shocking look into the end of life/palliative care system in the country and show just how broken the incentives are industry-wide.

Re: It's getting harder to die

#26

Post by louwrentius »

vundercind wrote: post #11

Recently watched someone close die over a couple days, after a long decline. The last 24 hours were monstrous to inflict on anyone. Torture. Evil. Hours and hours of faltering breathing, often restarting with what was plainly a panicked adrenaline-pumping response. It looked like they felt like they were about to drown every few minutes , hour, after hour, no relief. No IV fluids (terminal anyway, so no trying to kee…

I’m quite convinced that I live in a country where we never let people die like this.

Also, I guess prolonging treatment is in the interest of for-profit hospitals as found in other countries, thus as long as your suffering is profitable, you wil…

Re: It's getting harder to die

#27

Post by xenospn »

kingkongjaffa wrote: post #12
ericmcer wrote: post #3

Kind of a tough read, I just turned 37 and this was the year when it really hit home that your body degrades and sometimes it never goes back to "normal". I was used to sports injuries being a pattern of injury -> recovery -> ramp back up to 100%, but have suffered some injuries recently and am coming to terms with realizing I will never return to 100%. They will be lingering things I deal with for the rest of my lif…

This really resonates with me. I’m 30 now. I had a rotator cuff injury last year and lost some range of motion in my shoulder for about 6 months. This year I got a personal trainer for the first time. I’m really trying to fight to get in shape and stay in shape. I spent my 20’s working and for the last 5 years I work remotely, largely ignoring my health. Sitting in a home office all day is really bad for you.

Go on walks! The sun/allergen exposure and vitamin D will be good for you. Literally put walks on your calendar so it’s easier to remember.

Re: It's getting harder to die

#28

Post by 01HNNWZ0MV43FF »

Theodores wrote: post #16

This is a really good article, not least for the list of ways that you will be kept medically alive. As for the premise of the article, it is definitely getting easier to die. We had the plumbers and the rubbish collecting workers clear up our communicable chronic diseases, we de-industrialised and cleared up the air, we quit smoking, put on our seat belts and reigned in the alcohol. So far so good. But, if you look…

I mean Biden also comes off slow cause of his stutter. He just has to survive inauguration.

Re: It's getting harder to die

#29

Post by blue_dragon »

kingkongjaffa wrote: post #12
ericmcer wrote: post #3

Kind of a tough read, I just turned 37 and this was the year when it really hit home that your body degrades and sometimes it never goes back to "normal". I was used to sports injuries being a pattern of injury -> recovery -> ramp back up to 100%, but have suffered some injuries recently and am coming to terms with realizing I will never return to 100%. They will be lingering things I deal with for the rest of my lif…

This really resonates with me. I’m 30 now. I had a rotator cuff injury last year and lost some range of motion in my shoulder for about 6 months. This year I got a personal trainer for the first time. I’m really trying to fight to get in shape and stay in shape. I spent my 20’s working and for the last 5 years I work remotely, largely ignoring my health. Sitting in a home office all day is really bad for you.

Use the next several years to build as much muscle as you can without damaging your joints. It gets extraordinarily difficult to add new muscle as you enter your mid-30s, but fortunately you still have time. I work out 3-4 days per week for ~90 minutes each.

If you've never done strength training before, you may be pleasantly surprised to learn how much extra mass you can add, while remaining on a typical diet, with zero chemical assistance. Your trainer will be able to help you.

Re: It's getting harder to die

#30

Post by pb060 »

I faced a similar problem as my wife had a chorionangioma, a placenta tumor. Or it was my son, it’s even hard to tell who had it as placenta is external to both. In the hospital where we were, they were doing their best to keep the baby alive despite all the issues with the rupture of the amniotic sac and body damages that he already had, which I understand. What I didn’t understand, and still don’t, is how they were getting ready to try and keep him alive once he would be born, most probably at the 6th month and with probable brain and other physical damages. I respect doctors who can’t choose between their patients life and death, and most of all parents who love their to be born kids so much that they are ready to face a life or hardship. I just think that medicine should not just focus on keeping patients alive, but also consider the quality of their life before taking a decision together with the relatives.
Post reply on HN