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Vigorous Exercise, Cognitive Decline, and High Blood Pressure

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Re: Vigorous Exercise, Cognitive Decline, and High Blood Pressure

#101

Post by jiriknesl »

lurking_swe wrote: post #69
pif wrote: post #20

If you want slimmer people, invest in hunger-stopping pills. Have a lettuce satiate you like two ham and cheese baguettes, and the obesity problem will disappear overnight.

sure, then you have a society deficient in nutrition because they got full on french fries lol. The problem is cultural, and also because of GREED. Companies make so much money off of selling you junk food, pharma makes a lot selling you pills, etc. It’s not a biological problem 99% of the time. You really want to solve this overnight? Simple: • force free healthy and delicious meals in public schools. regardless of…

This is a very cynical take.

Companies are full of people. Those people want to do good things and want to help others.

There are plenty of companies who sell vegetables, fruits, free-range eggs and beef, meal replacement shakes with full spectrum of macros & micros, packed foods for vegetarians, keto, paleo eaters.

It's not particularly companies fault that someone buys a cheeseburger instead of omelette with tomatoes or whole grain sandwich with turkey & lettuce. Options are there no matter where you live.

--

I agree with teaching kids about nutrition and impacts of obesity. That makes 100% sense.

Re: Vigorous Exercise, Cognitive Decline, and High Blood Pressure

#102

Post by dTal »

vmfunction wrote: post #42
keiferski wrote: post #4

I am no expert on the public health system and so I'm more than willing to be educated/corrected here, but I have the following impression: There is more money to be made by stakeholders treating health problems than there is in preventing them. And so there is a lot more money and effort invested in developing pharmaceutical and treatment solutions than there is in preventing the problems they treat – even though th…

>There is more money to be made by stakeholders treating health problems than there is in preventing them. And so there is a lot more money and effort invested in developing pharmaceutical and treatment solutions than there is in preventing them – even though that would be far, far better for society as a whole. The health care system in US is very broken. This paper [1] really outlines. It not just more money made i…

Neatly skewered 3 decades ago in the Sunday funnies: https://www.gocomics.com/outland/2023/01/16

It is depressing how many of those comic strips are still relevant today.

Re: Vigorous Exercise, Cognitive Decline, and High Blood Pressure

#103

Post by pif »

thefz wrote: post #47
pif wrote: post #20

If you want slimmer people, invest in hunger-stopping pills. Have a lettuce satiate you like two ham and cheese baguettes, and the obesity problem will disappear overnight.

Exercise has benefits that span far beyond weight loss, like the article you clearly haven't opened states. In fact, in many cases it's not even necessary for weight loss alone, as controlling the caloric input is enough.

> Exercise has benefits that span far beyond weight loss,

Don't you think that slimmer people are more inclined to enjoy exercising?

Re: Vigorous Exercise, Cognitive Decline, and High Blood Pressure

#104

Post by pif »

keiferski wrote: post #32
pif wrote: post #20

If you want slimmer people, invest in hunger-stopping pills. Have a lettuce satiate you like two ham and cheese baguettes, and the obesity problem will disappear overnight.

Isn’t that pretty much what Ozempic does?

I don't know this Ozempic. If people take it for at most a few years, then yes, it may do what I described. On the other end, if people are supposed to take it for life, then it does surely not!

Re: Vigorous Exercise, Cognitive Decline, and High Blood Pressure

#105

Post by belZaah »

keiferski wrote: post #4

I am no expert on the public health system and so I'm more than willing to be educated/corrected here, but I have the following impression: There is more money to be made by stakeholders treating health problems than there is in preventing them. And so there is a lot more money and effort invested in developing pharmaceutical and treatment solutions than there is in preventing the problems they treat – even though th…

> There is more money to be made by stakeholders treating health problems than there is in preventing them

This is not in line with economic theory. According to it, actors would simply price the treatment and an npv of the potential future cash flow. It would actually be more beneficial to treat people completely, as it reduces the risk of the cash-cow suddenly being hit by a car, for example.

Re: Vigorous Exercise, Cognitive Decline, and High Blood Pressure

#106

Post by navjack27 »

georgeplusplus wrote: post #89
johnnyanmac wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>the problems are lack of time for exercise and money for a healthy diet. pretty much. You go to some circles that will keep swearing by "Calories in, Calories out", and blaming any detteral of this as laziness. It's basically the equivalent of saying "stop smoking" to a smoker. Yes, they are objectiely right, but also miss all the subtlety of the steps needed to "stop smoking". Time is definitely the biggest factor,…

Where exactly is the nuance in this? I pity the smoker more because they don’t have to smoke but feel compelled to smoke through addiction. You have direct control over how many calories you consume and it’s a basic human instinct to eat. Saying there’s nuanced steps inbetween is just a way to hand wave away someone’s laziness to not tackle the problem.

The same compulsion that drives the smoker to smoke drives the person that eats compulsively to eat. Be it for comfort or habit. Hormones and neurotransmitters drive behavior.

What gets deposited into your bank account and what gets stocked at your local grocery drives what you put into your body to survive.

If eating healthy is too expensive or outright impossible because of what is stocked at your local grocery and your hormones and neurotransmitters are telling you overwhelmingly to eat poorly... Is this laziness?

Re: Vigorous Exercise, Cognitive Decline, and High Blood Pressure

#107

Post by tzs »

CalRobert wrote: post #57
keiferski wrote: post #4

I am no expert on the public health system and so I'm more than willing to be educated/corrected here, but I have the following impression: There is more money to be made by stakeholders treating health problems than there is in preventing them. And so there is a lot more money and effort invested in developing pharmaceutical and treatment solutions than there is in preventing the problems they treat – even though th…

Well, one clear market-based solution would be pricing transportation appropriately. If people were allowed to not pay for car infrastructure (via parking minimums, restrictive zoning, taxpayer-funded highways, etc. et.) and take their bike and train instead there would be a strong price signal to encourage the healthier activity. I moved to the Netherlands a year ago and have already lost 9kg (about 20 pounds) witho…

Looking at car ownership rates in the US over time and comparing to hypertension rates over time there doesn't seem to be much correlation.

Re: Vigorous Exercise, Cognitive Decline, and High Blood Pressure

#108

Post by yosame »

navjack27 wrote: post #106
georgeplusplus wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where exactly is the nuance in this? I pity the smoker more because they don’t have to smoke but feel compelled to smoke through addiction. You have direct control over how many calories you consume and it’s a basic human instinct to eat. Saying there’s nuanced steps inbetween is just a way to hand wave away someone’s laziness to not tackle the problem.

The same compulsion that drives the smoker to smoke drives the person that eats compulsively to eat. Be it for comfort or habit. Hormones and neurotransmitters drive behavior. What gets deposited into your bank account and what gets stocked at your local grocery drives what you put into your body to survive. If eating healthy is too expensive or outright impossible because of what is stocked at your local grocery and…

I'd argue that it's harder to quit compulsive eating than it is to quit compulsive smoking. You can't go cold turkey on food

Re: Vigorous Exercise, Cognitive Decline, and High Blood Pressure

#109

Post by thefz »

pif wrote: post #103
thefz wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exercise has benefits that span far beyond weight loss, like the article you clearly haven't opened states. In fact, in many cases it's not even necessary for weight loss alone, as controlling the caloric input is enough.

> Exercise has benefits that span far beyond weight loss, Don't you think that slimmer people are more inclined to enjoy exercising?

Define slim? Many "skinnyfat" (no muscle, no fat) people don't like to move, and there are lots of muscular people that enjoy exercising.

Is that a function of bodyfat percentage? I doubt so as well. Ideal BF% in men goes from 8 to 20%, when I see lots of people above 20% in the trails or running/cycling around.

Besides, if the goal is weight loss, that can be achieved with caloric restriction and zero minutes of cardio. It's thermodynamics.

Move for the sake of it, not for weight loss.

Re: Vigorous Exercise, Cognitive Decline, and High Blood Pressure

#110

Post by GeoAtreides »

yosame wrote: post #108
navjack27 wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The same compulsion that drives the smoker to smoke drives the person that eats compulsively to eat. Be it for comfort or habit. Hormones and neurotransmitters drive behavior. What gets deposited into your bank account and what gets stocked at your local grocery drives what you put into your body to survive. If eating healthy is too expensive or outright impossible because of what is stocked at your local grocery and…

I'd argue that it's harder to quit compulsive eating than it is to quit compulsive smoking. You can't go cold turkey on food

That's true, you can't go cold turkey on food, but you can change what you eat. Gorging on fats and proteins and high density foods (nuts, cheeses, legumes, olive oil, eggs, etc) will have a very different effect than gorging on fats and sugars (pastries, white breads, soda etc.)
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