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EU to greenlight Chat Control tomorrow

patrick-breyer.de

91–100 of 360 posts

Re: EU to greenlight Chat Control tomorrow

#91
post #4

This is why the roles of the major players in society (government, monopolies) need to be circumscribed. Large organizations will always try to grow in size and power. We need some sort of human right for digital privacy to make this sort of thing illegal.

[deleted]

Re: EU to greenlight Chat Control tomorrow

#92
post #4

This is why the roles of the major players in society (government, monopolies) need to be circumscribed. Large organizations will always try to grow in size and power. We need some sort of human right for digital privacy to make this sort of thing illegal.

Free speech absolutists like myself got run over culturally with hate speech laws so for anyone continuing on the fight I wish you the best of luck.

Yeah and there are even worse things that haven't been internationally banned.

Re: EU to greenlight Chat Control tomorrow

#93
post #84
post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Client side scanning is going to be required, it doesn’t matter if you’re on a VPN if your device is self-reporting.

How would my device be (self-)reporting?

All legal apps have to be self reporting I guess...

So whenever you send anything to example.com you also send it to government-snooping-service.org?domain=example.com.

And if you refuse to adjust your app you will get fined I guess.

Will curl have to self report every request? Lol...

Every client? Like will axios need to self report?

Re: EU to greenlight Chat Control tomorrow

#95
post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Canada and the EU certainly don’t care about free speech.

That comment is not doing a good job of convincing me.

Are you actually open to being convinced or are you going to justify every example of those governments compelling and controlling speech?

Re: EU to greenlight Chat Control tomorrow

#96
post #74
post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> We need some sort of human right for digital privacy to make this sort of thing illegal. That's how you get another level of super-government, i.e. one more tyrant in the chain Historically the circle breaks only with revolution and violence . Maybe checks and balances would work as a system, but the EU has neither

> Historically the circle breaks only with revolution and violence . This sort of rhetoric is dangerous. > Maybe checks and balances would work as a system It does seem to be working well in America.

> This sort of rhetoric is dangerous.

For governments.

> It does seem to be working well in America.

They say ignorance is bliss.

Re: EU to greenlight Chat Control tomorrow

#97

I already kicked up a shit here in NL together with a few other well connected people (with success) but it's a little frustrating that there's little more to do other than hope that nerds in other EU countries can make a difference.

Looks like the Netherlands is already opposed, for what good that will do. Any useful links to share with people?

Re: EU to greenlight Chat Control tomorrow

#98
post #74
post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> We need some sort of human right for digital privacy to make this sort of thing illegal. That's how you get another level of super-government, i.e. one more tyrant in the chain Historically the circle breaks only with revolution and violence . Maybe checks and balances would work as a system, but the EU has neither

> Historically the circle breaks only with revolution and violence . This sort of rhetoric is dangerous. > Maybe checks and balances would work as a system It does seem to be working well in America.

> This sort of rhetoric is dangerous

How?

Re: EU to greenlight Chat Control tomorrow

#99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Free speech absolutists like myself got run over culturally with hate speech laws so for anyone continuing on the fight I wish you the best of luck.

Anti-hate speech got you? What were you trying to say exactly? One can go on X right now and spew any hate speech that one wants. How about just political opinions? How quickly we forgot "free speech zones." This is the government actually limiting public speech in the USA. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_speech_zone BTW, I am not for this regulation in any way. I just don't see the connection to hate speech.

Free Speech Absolutism was/is connected with hate speech because sites that hold up such an ideal end up being the landing pad for the very worst people who were banned everywhere else. There aren't enough normal people who vote with their money/time/engagement to reach critical mass on those platforms.

And turns out very few people want actually free speech. We're in a forum with strong moderation and the discussion is better for it. Most communities self-enforce norms even without central moderation. There's no easy answers when you have to reckon with the real effects speech has. Germany wasn't special, they weren't even alone at the time. What folks call "fascism" naturally precipitates under the right conditions and I can't think of any time in history where it's been dealt with by the socratic method and not violence of a kind.

But once you have a word you can accuse someone of with actual repercussions folks acting in bad-faith try to fit people they don't like into the mould. We think ourselves so much better than those silly puritans accusing people of witchcraft but we just changed the words. I'm sure you could name five off the top of your head that people level without any kind of justification.

Re: EU to greenlight Chat Control tomorrow

#100
post #71
post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> We learnt the value of free speech the hard way, and very slowly Did we though? Unfortunately outside the US and a handful of other places free speech doesn't seem to be valued that much, often it's even viewed as a threat (and I'm not talking about authoritarian regimes). It's a double-edged sword to be fair, enabling misinformation and chaos.

> Unfortunately outside the US and a handful of other places free speech doesn't seem to be valued that much, often it's even viewed as a threat Can you convince me of this? Because it's not my impression.

Amongst other examples:

https://globalfreedomofexpression.columbia.edu/cases/e-s-v-a....

Not that I'm a particularly huge fan of some of the opinions that some of these people tend to express (to be fair in this case it's something that Muslims/their holy books acknowledge as well so it shouldn't be controversial at all...) but the whole idea of "balancing the rights to freedom of religion and expression" just seems extremely repulsive to me.

Of course this is a spectrum but having an (effectively) immutable constitution that guarantees freedom of speech is certainly worth something.

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