IKEA's retailer's solved global 'unhappy worker' crisis by raising salaries • Hacker News Board

Re: IKEA's retailer's solved global 'unhappy worker' crisis by raising salaries

#201

Post by cess11 » Fri, Jun 14, 2024, 8:21 PM UTC

tored wrote: post #194

cess11 wrote: post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Obviously you belong to the same political movement as he did. A few years before his death he said in an interview the his friend Per Engdahl was a great man. He was a fascist when he died. It made a solid impression on IKEA as a company. It's why unions have never been able to form there, it's why the company 'culture' has a distinctly parasocial 'family'-character, it's why the trust invests heavily in keeping ref…

No, I'm not part of that movement, another smear, directly from the communist handbook. But you will get nowhere with that here. It is of course fine to question IKEA's business practices, myself is critical of many, personally I'm all in favour of unions as a union member myself, what is not okay is for bolsjeviks to steal companies by using the force of the government and undermine the entire economic model of soci…

You're quoting something that quotes a story Lindgren made up. Pomperipossa is not a real person. Here's from the previous link:

"Även om den fortfarande är en viktig påminnelse om värdet av låga marginalskatter, visar Timbros chefsekonom Jacob Lundbergs undersökning att hon faktiskt aldrig behövde betala 102 procent i skatt."

'Even if it's still an important reminder of the value of low marginal tax rates, an examination by the chief economist of Timbro [a reactionary propaganda organisation] shows that [Astrid Lindgren] never had to pay 102% in taxes'.

Sweden hasn't had bolsheviks since the war. The communist party dislodged politically from Moscow in the sixties, though they continued to receive funds for another decade or two. You must have a very weird view of how power was transfered from the tsar to the bolsheviks. Do you seriously think that the civil war had nothing to do with it and they did it through parliamentary deliberation, like with the löntagarfonder?

Or are you lying?

Edit: Your buddies at the reactionary think tank has made a neat little graph at the bottom here: https://timbro.se/skattekoll/marginalskatt/

Re: IKEA's retailer's solved global 'unhappy worker' crisis by raising salaries

#202

Post by sirspacey » Fri, Jun 14, 2024, 8:28 PM UTC

Libcat99 wrote: post #170

defrost wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's exactly why child care workers who look after packs of 15 to 20 kids at a time should be highly valued and paid a decent wage. It's how villages worked in the past, most adults did non child related work much of the time, some adults and some older children kept an eye on what the pooled group of kids were up to .. watching, sometimes educating, sometimes leading them in "work" building things, cooking, huntin…

All teachers should be well paid and well vetted. Teaching shouldn't be a self sacrifial social justice position, it should be an honored and well rewarded position.

Careful, you might get yourself into edtech. >-D

The average career length for teachers (not job, career) is 5 years and trending down.

The reason is not a secret: teaching is a brutal experience with sub-poverty wages. In most cases parents, students and the school administration are your adversaries. If it’s a public institution, political campaigns come crashing in annually with “us vs them” battles that make it awful no matter what side you are on.

It is not a job anyone should pursue.

Re: IKEA's retailer's solved global 'unhappy worker' crisis by raising salaries

#203

Post by coldtea » Fri, Jun 14, 2024, 8:59 PM UTC

jp57 wrote: post #7

misterbwong wrote: post #6

OP's link should really include the full title: Ikea’s boss solved the Swedish retailer’s global ‘unhappy worker’ crisis by raising salaries, introducing flexible working and subsidizing childcare Cutting it off there just makes it seem like ikea thinks "more money = happy workers" when in reality it is more nuanced than that.

Subsidizing childcare is also "more money", but only for some workers. If the others don't notice or don't care that they're getting paid less for the same work that's great for the company. I am in favor of flexible work arrangements, and I have no idea if those have costs to the company, or how much more you'd need to pay the workers to accept the less flexible arrangements.

>Subsidizing childcare is also "more money", but only for some workers. If the others don't notice or don't care that they're getting paid less for the same work that's great for the company.

Such an american thing to say.

No, we don't mind having the company pay colleagues' children childcare on top of our (equal to theirs) salary. We'd hate to be in a society where such a petty mindset would be common, that would be living in some kind of social hell.

Re: IKEA's retailer's solved global 'unhappy worker' crisis by raising salaries

#204

Post by coldtea » Fri, Jun 14, 2024, 9:00 PM UTC

from-nibly wrote: post #22

malfist wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Look, I'm a DINK, don't have kids, never plan to have kids, don't even like kids. But child care is important to both the parents and society. Not subsidizing child care often means one parent has to leave the workforce, and that's almost always worse off for everyone than if they were able to afford child care and can contribute

Right, because raising kids isn't contributing to society.

Not being able to have kids because you can't afford one parent to quit, isn't.

Re: IKEA's retailer's solved global 'unhappy worker' crisis by raising salaries

#205

Post by tored » Fri, Jun 14, 2024, 9:57 PM UTC

cess11 wrote: post #201

tored wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, I'm not part of that movement, another smear, directly from the communist handbook. But you will get nowhere with that here. It is of course fine to question IKEA's business practices, myself is critical of many, personally I'm all in favour of unions as a union member myself, what is not okay is for bolsjeviks to steal companies by using the force of the government and undermine the entire economic model of soci…

You're quoting something that quotes a story Lindgren made up. Pomperipossa is not a real person. Here's from the previous link: "Även om den fortfarande är en viktig påminnelse om värdet av låga marginalskatter, visar Timbros chefsekonom Jacob Lundbergs undersökning att hon faktiskt aldrig behövde betala 102 procent i skatt." 'Even if it's still an important reminder of the value of low marginal tax rates, an examin…

> Pomperipossa is not a real person

No shit. Talk about desperate argument.

She didn't need to pay the 102% tax in the end because of the Social democrats changed the law (as I already described earlier) because it became too unpopular, if they hadn't she would have. Thus is was not made up, it was a reality. Confirmed by the report from Ratio. Thus if Astrid Lindgren hadn't written that article Social democrats would have been perfectly fine with Swedes paying more than 100% in taxes. That is why Social democrats during this era were radicals. And also even after the change in law you could still pay 90% tax.

> You must have a very weird view of how power was transfered from the tsar to the bolsheviks

It didn't happened that way. It was the Mensheviks that took the power from the Tsar in the February Revolution of 1917. The Bolsheviks took in turn power from the Mensheviks in the October Revolution of 1917 and then murdered the Tsar and his family who was already in house arrest by the Mensheviks. Thus Bolsheviks did not remove the Tsar from power, a common falsehood by Bolsheviks, because he had already abdicated.

The Russian Civil War was a consequence of the Bolshevik Revolution against the Provisional Government, which was not accepted by many different political groups, everything from social democrats, liberals to monarchists. Somehow Bolsheviks always forgets this important detail. Wonder why.

But anyway, I was correct about Löntagarfonderna, the implementation, the goal and it's consequences.

Re: IKEA's retailer's solved global 'unhappy worker' crisis by raising salaries

#206

Post by autoexec » Fri, Jun 14, 2024, 11:55 PM UTC

StackRanker3000 wrote: post #198

autoexec wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not only would it be life changing for most of their employees, but consider how much the executives are making ( https://www1.salary.com/WALMART-INC-Executive-Salaries.html ) How much do you think Suresh Kumar's life would change if he made 10 million next year instead of 14.5 million? Do you think he would have to stop buying the groceries he usually does, or that he would have to cancel a vacation? It wouldn't cha…

How much do you think the lives of Walmart’s employees would change if Suresh Kumar would forego those 4.5 million and distribute it among them instead? When you have 2.1 million people working under you, you don’t need to skim much from each of their individual output to make a lot of money.

> How much do you think the lives of Walmart’s employees would change if Suresh Kumar would forego those 4.5 million and distribute it among them instead?

Him alone? Not much, but take a tiny bit from everyone making >1M and increase the pay of only those employees who don't already make a living wage and I'm guessing it would make a huge difference to the lives of those employees while still making no difference to the lives of the people who'd be taking a bit less.

As a bonus, putting that money into the hands of the people who would spend it, and most likely spend it on paying off debt and local goods/services, would help the economy and a lot of other people too.

Re: IKEA's retailer's solved global 'unhappy worker' crisis by raising salaries

#207

Post by cess11 » Sat, Jun 15, 2024, 4:45 AM UTC

tored wrote: post #205

cess11 wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're quoting something that quotes a story Lindgren made up. Pomperipossa is not a real person. Here's from the previous link: "Även om den fortfarande är en viktig påminnelse om värdet av låga marginalskatter, visar Timbros chefsekonom Jacob Lundbergs undersökning att hon faktiskt aldrig behövde betala 102 procent i skatt." 'Even if it's still an important reminder of the value of low marginal tax rates, an examin…

> Pomperipossa is not a real person No shit. Talk about desperate argument. She didn't need to pay the 102% tax in the end because of the Social democrats changed the law (as I already described earlier) because it became too unpopular, if they hadn't she would have. Thus is was not made up, it was a reality. Confirmed by the report from Ratio. Thus if Astrid Lindgren hadn't written that article Social democrats woul…

How is it desperate?

You don't seem to understand how marginal tax rate works. It's OK, almost no one on the far right does, but almost everyone knows a little about that story about Pomperipossa.

You're like a machine, just ticking away with confidence. I hope I get to see your movement die out during my lifetime.

Re: IKEA's retailer's solved global 'unhappy worker' crisis by raising salaries

#208

Post by refurb » Sat, Jun 15, 2024, 5:03 AM UTC

lucumo wrote: post #121

refurb wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ehhh… better for the kid? Kids can get plenty of social interactions and variety with a stay at home parent. Plus they get the benefit of time with parents, parents can focus on doing things they think is valuable for the kid. To somehow claim that childcare comes at no cost for kids is naive.

> Kids can get plenty of social interactions and variety with a stay at home parent. The keyword there is "can". They can, it's just less likely. Especially when a parent takes the "stay at home" part too literal. > To somehow claim that childcare comes at no cost for kids is naive. Well, my experience with my kids was that their daycare was beneficial for them. They did not always want to go, but they definitely enj…

I'm not sure I'd use your kids alone as a representation of the experience of day care for the entire population.

And you're only counting the benefits of daycare, but ignoring the opportunity cost of less time with parents and the benefits that come from that.

I don't disagree that there are benefits to daycare, but where is the optimum? A few hours a day? Or the kids in daycare from 8am to 6pm, so they see their parents for maybe 2 hours a day before bed time?

Re: IKEA's retailer's solved global 'unhappy worker' crisis by raising salaries

#209

Post by tored » Sat, Jun 15, 2024, 7:43 AM UTC

cess11 wrote: post #207

tored wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Pomperipossa is not a real person No shit. Talk about desperate argument. She didn't need to pay the 102% tax in the end because of the Social democrats changed the law (as I already described earlier) because it became too unpopular, if they hadn't she would have. Thus is was not made up, it was a reality. Confirmed by the report from Ratio. Thus if Astrid Lindgren hadn't written that article Social democrats woul…

How is it desperate? You don't seem to understand how marginal tax rate works. It's OK, almost no one on the far right does, but almost everyone knows a little about that story about Pomperipossa. You're like a machine, just ticking away with confidence. I hope I get to see your movement die out during my lifetime.

Ladies and gentlemen, this is what a sore loser looks like. No arguments left, only smears. Desperate because you are used to that your bullying tactic works, that people back off and gets sidetracked, but here it didn't, which I already explained to you that you get nowhere with that here.

Swedes rejected your ideas, first in the general election of 1976, were Social democrats got ousted and lost an election for the first time in 40 years, and the second time in of the largest demonstrations ever recorded in Swedish history, the 4th of October demonstration of 1983, against fund socialism.

And if you are old enough you saw your own movement die with the fall of the Berlin wall on the ninth of November 1989. I remember, I saw it on Television.

Re: IKEA's retailer's solved global 'unhappy worker' crisis by raising salaries

#210

Post by cess11 » Sat, Jun 15, 2024, 9:24 AM UTC

tored wrote: post #209

cess11 wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is it desperate? You don't seem to understand how marginal tax rate works. It's OK, almost no one on the far right does, but almost everyone knows a little about that story about Pomperipossa. You're like a machine, just ticking away with confidence. I hope I get to see your movement die out during my lifetime.

Ladies and gentlemen, this is what a sore loser looks like. No arguments left, only smears. Desperate because you are used to that your bullying tactic works, that people back off and gets sidetracked, but here it didn't, which I already explained to you that you get nowhere with that here. Swedes rejected your ideas, first in the general election of 1976, were Social democrats got ousted and lost an election for the…

I'm closer to syndicalism, but unorganised since I'm in a position of leadership.

It's weird to phrase it as "Swedes rejected", when it was the labour buyer's cartel that bused people to the demonstration in Stockholm, and the Social Democrats polled quite high after LAS and the general parental insurance. The string of wildcat strikes at the time didn't affect their polling performance.

It was newspaper scandals that won that election, things like the Pomperipossa story, Ingmar Bergman being investigated for tax fraud and leaving the country, a union leader lounging on the beach in Franco's Spain, things like that. And, of course, mythmaking of the sort you're engaging in here, claiming that reformism is actually bolshevism and whatnot.