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Ask HN: Why is nobody manufacturing low tech electric cars in 2024?

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Re: Ask HN: Why is nobody manufacturing low tech electric cars in 2024?

#131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>dumb phones, or completely open-source smart phones. What use are dumb phones (i.e., feature phones)? They're only good for actually talking to people, and the only people I know who regularly use their phones for talking are my elderly relatives (in their 80s). Everyone younger than that uses their phones for: texting, games, web, various apps such as banking, etc. Actual talking is fairly rare, and usually only wi…

That doesn’t fit my experience. Anything that involves typing out paragraphs of text almost immediately revert to a quick phone call where you can get the idea across in seconds instead of lots of minutes. These are people in their mid and early 30s.

In my experience, when this happens, we just use the voice or video-calling function of whatever chat app we're using texting through. We don't use phone numbers. I've never actually even called my girlfriend, for instance; I only have her phone number in my contacts list for emergencies, but when I've talked with her, it's been through our chat app (LINE), since we can use video there.

Re: Ask HN: Why is nobody manufacturing low tech electric cars in 2024?

#132
post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's what your phone or tablet is for. No need for all that custom UI tech in the car, just provide a documented API and open-source app you can run on your phone or even dedicate a tablet for it. Proprietary screens and their supporting computers will be obsolete quickly, will break easily and be exorbitantly expensive to fix/replace, and of course there's a good chance they will also surveil everything you do, mo…

I have no confidence that auto/carplay of today will work with whatever phone I have in 12 years. Car makers want to ship their cars and forget about them. They hate warranty work. Tesla does software updates but the others don't want to (they do but only when they must or if they can charge for them - the maps on my 12 year old car are way out of date because like most car buyers I won't pay to update them). I'm not…

I have a head unit from 2014 that has CarPlay. I have never updated it and it works fine with latest iOS. I don’t see why it can’t do the same for another ten years.

Re: Ask HN: Why is nobody manufacturing low tech electric cars in 2024?

#133
post #105

I hope someday there will be a backlash. - dumb TVs, or open-source TVs. - dumb phones, or completely open-source smart phones. - dumb EVs, or completely open-source EVs. I think the profit for open source stuff is not guaranteed, so funding a company is hard. People who fund companies want lock-in, patents, product monopoly. They don't want something that can be copied and productized by another company that had no…

>dumb phones, or completely open-source smart phones. What use are dumb phones (i.e., feature phones)? They're only good for actually talking to people, and the only people I know who regularly use their phones for talking are my elderly relatives (in their 80s). Everyone younger than that uses their phones for: texting, games, web, various apps such as banking, etc. Actual talking is fairly rare, and usually only wi…

depends on what your goals are.

This post says "Just let me drive. I don't need fancy screens."

An analogy with a phone might be to just talk to people.

There are plenty more reasons for a dumb phone. Limited distraction for self/kids. Long battery time. privacy. sovereignty would align with open source, not necessarily dumb phone (you control the software)

Re: Ask HN: Why is nobody manufacturing low tech electric cars in 2024?

#134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not many would be willing to pay $1000 more for more buttons.

Maybe, maybe not. If you posed it to customers in that way, many would object. If you didn't, then a $1000 price increase wouldn't really be noticed. But it doesn't matter how many are willing. All I'm saying is that this is a thing that matters a great deal to me. It's pretty close to a dealbreaker. Even if I'm the only one that feels that way, it's still how I feel. The auto industry appears to not want to make car…

> But I do find it interesting that one of the things that I was always taught was a strength of our economic system is that it will produce a wide enough variety of goods that pretty much everyone will find a version of a product that they'd actually want. That it appears that it can't looks like a kind of failure to me.

heck, finding a sub-6" cellphone is next to impossible, outright impossible if you want high end features. and phones are way easier to create in different configurations than cars are.

Re: Ask HN: Why is nobody manufacturing low tech electric cars in 2024?

#135
post #19

Citroën Ami is about as low tech as you can get. If you want something more car-shaped, the Renault Zoe has very few tech feature. Similarly, Kia Soul has a reversing camera… and that's about it! No radar, lane assist, carplay or anything like that. Cstomers only want 3 things. A comfortable ride, a safe journey, and $thing. The problem is, everyone's one more thing is different. I want DAB radio, you want cruise con…

Erm, have you ever seen a German car? Pick any Audi, Mercedes, BMW and god forbid a Porsche and you'll have an options catalogue of epic proportions.

Different SKUs is an absolute non-issue in the car industry when it comes to tech gizmos and other optional extras. You want different suspension? No biggie. Manual vs automatic? Sure. Different kind of entertainment system? Of course. Different (branded) speakers? Yup.

Anything is optionable.

Re: Ask HN: Why is nobody manufacturing low tech electric cars in 2024?

#136
post #19

Citroën Ami is about as low tech as you can get. If you want something more car-shaped, the Renault Zoe has very few tech feature. Similarly, Kia Soul has a reversing camera… and that's about it! No radar, lane assist, carplay or anything like that. Cstomers only want 3 things. A comfortable ride, a safe journey, and $thing. The problem is, everyone's one more thing is different. I want DAB radio, you want cruise con…

Wouldn't it be fun if electric cars were the same way as PC's. Plug and play the parts you want, switch motor / battery.. choose a new chassis as you wish. And LED lights of course.

The vast majority of PCs sold today are not that way anymore.

Re: Ask HN: Why is nobody manufacturing low tech electric cars in 2024?

#137
post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>dumb phones, or completely open-source smart phones. What use are dumb phones (i.e., feature phones)? They're only good for actually talking to people, and the only people I know who regularly use their phones for talking are my elderly relatives (in their 80s). Everyone younger than that uses their phones for: texting, games, web, various apps such as banking, etc. Actual talking is fairly rare, and usually only wi…

depends on what your goals are. This post says "Just let me drive. I don't need fancy screens." An analogy with a phone might be to just talk to people. There are plenty more reasons for a dumb phone. Limited distraction for self/kids. Long battery time. privacy. sovereignty would align with open source, not necessarily dumb phone (you control the software)

>depends on what your goals are. >An analogy with a phone might be to just talk to people.

Sure, I'm just pointing out that I don't think very many people these days actually want such a thing. Outside of HN (which seems to have a lot of very anti-tech people curiously), all the people I know, of all age ranges, simply don't actually use phones much for voice calling. When they do, it's usually just for talking to businesses as I said before, not for family and friends. Instead, people are using phones for so many other non-voice-calling things which simply won't work on a dumbphone.

I feel like this is one of those things where people are appealing to nostalgia, but no one actually puts their money where their mouth is. Also, last I heard, dumbphones (flipphones) really are still available in many markets for people who want them, but almost no one does except perhaps for some elderly people. So I think this is really just people whining about the "good ol' days" while forgetting they weren't that good.

Re: Ask HN: Why is nobody manufacturing low tech electric cars in 2024?

#138
post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, I understand that it's a cost-savings measure by the automakers, but that's not relevant to me as a car owner. If the added expense is so onerous to the automaker, then they can raise the price of the car to make up for it. I'd buy that, where I won't buy a car that has inferior controls. Why would I, when there is still a plethora of older cars available that better meet my needs?

Not many would be willing to pay $1000 more for more buttons.

I drive a twenty year old Volvo, and I went to a dealer to buy a new one a few months ago. I didn't buy anything because basic functions are all behind crappy screen UIs instead of good old buttons.

I would definitely pay an extra $1,000 for a version with actual buttons... and a smaller screen.

Re: Ask HN: Why is nobody manufacturing low tech electric cars in 2024?

#139
As usual with these kinds of things, European standards bodies to the rescue [1]:

>Euro NCAP – Europe’s leading automotive safety industry body – has stated that from 2026 new guidance will be introduced over physical buttons and touchscreens.

>Euro NCAP’s rules are not mandatory for manufacturers to follow, but the threat of losing points will likely impact the decisions of many of the leading brands in the years ahead.

Although I would prefer a hard ban of touchscreen-only car controls in EU countries, which would obviously have more of an impact.

[1]: https://www.rac.co.uk/drive/news/driving-tech/is-the-beginni... (5th Mar 2024)

Re: Ask HN: Why is nobody manufacturing low tech electric cars in 2024?

#140
Lived in China 2009-2022, when I arrived they were just starting to experience the boom - and forced China-style adoption (aka "all gas scooters are banned starting from tomorrow" out of blue) - of electric scooters. At that time I wondered, why not just "put two scooters together" with a shell, and voila, a car!

Fast forward to 2020s and that's exactly what's going on. There is a lot of EV "cars" cars in China that barely qualify as a car (e.g. Wuling Hongguang) and cost as low as 20,000 RMB (~US$3,000).

I would not want to buy those, though. The current EV boom is forced by planned economy with huge subsidies, which always attracts "wrong crowd" in China. There are hundreds of brands right now, but once the subsidies dry up, 99% of them will shut down, leaving unsupported hastily slapped together cars to rot.

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