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Ask HN: Why is nobody manufacturing low tech electric cars in 2024?

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Re: Ask HN: Why is nobody manufacturing low tech electric cars in 2024?

#71

Post by kkfx »

Because OEMs want you to be their puppet. So they need to remain in control on the "cars" the sell, to resell driving data to insurances, video to various third party (including porn ones) just to cite recent "scandals", and they need to justify the absurd price of new macro-bugs on wheels.

Unfortunately most citizens do not even understand the tech so they do not even know that the crappy car-app is actually connected to the OEM servers like the car, they do not even know the car collect gazillion of data and so on. So the OEM can do pretty whatever they want, the percentage of people who understand is so little that nobody hear them.

Re: Ask HN: Why is nobody manufacturing low tech electric cars in 2024?

#72

Post by JohnFen »

bryanlarsen wrote: post #68
JohnFen wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The big reason screens matter for electric cars is planning long range trips with stops at a battery charge location. But that doesn't explain why automakers are moving the regular controls from physical buttons to the touchscreen. That's the part that I consider a serious problem.

Buttons are surprisingly expensive; not just the button itself but the wiring and the labor. Let's WAG at $20 per button. $20 * a few dozen buttons is real money.

Yes, I understand that it's a cost-savings measure by the automakers, but that's not relevant to me as a car owner.

If the added expense is so onerous to the automaker, then they can raise the price of the car to make up for it. I'd buy that, where I won't buy a car that has inferior controls. Why would I, when there is still a plethora of older cars available that better meet my needs?

Re: Ask HN: Why is nobody manufacturing low tech electric cars in 2024?

#73

Post by kube-system »

creesch wrote: post #66
kube-system wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only reason that exists for PCs is the same reason we even use the word “PC”: they’re all just legacy holdovers from manufacturers copying IBM. And really, the subset of the market that still follows these standards is small, and shrinking. The vast majority of PCs today are laptops with few, if any, swappable parts. Pretty much the only segment where this still exists is the enthusiast subset of the gaming PC ma…

Also, server hardware. It isn't as it is only kept around for those stubborn gamer enthusiast. The enthusiast market more or less is an extra revenue stream for a lot of hardware that is developed for the server market first. It is a bit more complex than that of course and generally speaking you are right.

Server hardware has abandoned a good bit of interchangeability too. While you can still usually count on socketed CPUs, socketed memory, and interchangeable storage, there's a lot of proprietary components used on servers beyond that. Motherboard and power supply form factors are often proprietary, and it is not uncommon for expansion cards to be proprietary or non-standard implementations.

Things like ATX power supplies, ATX/mATX motherboards, tower cases, are pretty squarely for the PC gaming segment now. It's difficult to even find a "business" motherboard these days, where as 20 years ago, they were nearly all designed with this use-case first. There's ASRock Rack type stuff that targets some custom server-type use cases, but the big server manufacturers make their own proprietary stuff.

Re: Ask HN: Why is nobody manufacturing low tech electric cars in 2024?

#75

Post by bryanlarsen »

JohnFen wrote: post #72
bryanlarsen wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Buttons are surprisingly expensive; not just the button itself but the wiring and the labor. Let's WAG at $20 per button. $20 * a few dozen buttons is real money.

Yes, I understand that it's a cost-savings measure by the automakers, but that's not relevant to me as a car owner. If the added expense is so onerous to the automaker, then they can raise the price of the car to make up for it. I'd buy that, where I won't buy a car that has inferior controls. Why would I, when there is still a plethora of older cars available that better meet my needs?

Not many would be willing to pay $1000 more for more buttons.

Re: Ask HN: Why is nobody manufacturing low tech electric cars in 2024?

#76

Post by bluGill »

jacknews wrote: post #62
bluGill wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have no confidence that auto/carplay of today will work with whatever phone I have in 12 years. Car makers want to ship their cars and forget about them. They hate warranty work. Tesla does software updates but the others don't want to (they do but only when they must or if they can charge for them - the maps on my 12 year old car are way out of date because like most car buyers I won't pay to update them). I'm not…

But if it's a documented API with open-source 'reference' app, everyone can make new versions, enhancements, etc. And for sure, assuming a popular standard physical/radio interface is used now, it will still be supported, either through backwards-compatibility in the standard, or with gateway dongles etc, far into the future. I have no confidence you'll be able to get a replacement screen or computer mainboard etc fo…

Where is carplay documented. Before you answer check the license to be sure you can use it.

i agree screens won't exist at any price in 10 years. Hope youre lasts.

Re: Ask HN: Why is nobody manufacturing low tech electric cars in 2024?

#77

Post by ofrzeta »

raxxorraxor wrote: post #69
tjansen wrote: post #32

Not sure about other regions, but in the EU, low tech cars are not allowed. Required safety systems include emergency breaking, emergency lane-keeping, intelligent speed assistance (car must use cameras or GPS to determine current speed limit), driver attention warning systems and many more. That fancy screen is really not a cost factor. These days you can buy after-market screens with Car Play and Android auto suppo…

> Not sure about other regions, but in the EU, low tech cars are not allowed. Which is a rather recent development and certainly a protectionist move and will hinder adaptation massively. You need the full suite for lane controls, attention monitoring, emergency brake systems, etc... It is simply impossible to now release low tech cars and it is a political decision by the EU that is highly questionable.

Yeah, so called "Vision Zero": "The EU’s long-term goal is to move as close as possible to zero fatalities in road transport by 2050"

https://cinea.ec.europa.eu/publications/eu-road-safety-towar...

Re: Ask HN: Why is nobody manufacturing low tech electric cars in 2024?

#78

Post by kylehotchkiss »

Because data collection is a very profitable market for car manufacturers to enter. Most cars these days can make it to 200,000 miles and people buy them less often.

I wish there was a website that had a guide for how to disable the 4g chip for every car model.

Re: Ask HN: Why is nobody manufacturing low tech electric cars in 2024?

#79

Post by ofrzeta »

Kuinox wrote: post #45
tjansen wrote: post #32

Not sure about other regions, but in the EU, low tech cars are not allowed. Required safety systems include emergency breaking, emergency lane-keeping, intelligent speed assistance (car must use cameras or GPS to determine current speed limit), driver attention warning systems and many more. That fancy screen is really not a cost factor. These days you can buy after-market screens with Car Play and Android auto suppo…

It's wrong, we have the Twizy, the Ami and the Zoe in France. The most technological advanced thing in the Zoe is the Bluetooth to play music.

The Twizy was at least available as a model that made 80 km/h. The Ami can only go 50 or 45 which makes it usable as a city car only.

Re: Ask HN: Why is nobody manufacturing low tech electric cars in 2024?

#80

Post by kylehotchkiss »

jarbus wrote: post #74

I’d love a car like a Framework laptop but for EVs. I’d love to strip out the junk I don’t need and fix/change things myself for much cheaper than a mechanic.

Intension: low cost car repairs, longer service life

Reality: Fast N Furious guys realize the ECU is tunable, break all the parameters, remove the muffler, and make their engine explode within 20,000 miles in the noisiest way possible.

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