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The Weird Nerd comes with trade-offs

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Re: The Weird Nerd comes with trade-offs

#151

Post by aspenmayer »

Aurornis wrote: post #116
belinder wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just a guess here - but to make diagnosed people feel more included and part of a group, the more people get diagnosed even if it's 0.01%, the more safe the others feel because they're not alone, it stops being a stigma

> but to make diagnosed people feel more included and part of a group, the more people get diagnosed even if it's 0.01%, the more safe the others feel because they're not alone, I've worked with younger people in tech. I'm seeing a mix of effects, positive and negative, from increased diagnosis rates. On the plus side, some people are using their diagnoses to find helpful support material, techniques, and advice. On…

> I've had to explain to numerous people that having an ADHD diagnosis doesn't, for example, exempt them from the same performance review standards as their peers at work.

I can’t speak for you, but that isn’t at all accurate as far as I know. I myself would not say these kinds of things to a coworker, and definitely not to a subordinate one or one that reports to me, as I don’t work in HR or legal department, and I’m not intimately familiar with actual existing accommodations for ADHD and other conditions under the FMLA and other disability discrimination laws and regulations in the US or other countries.

This is a legal minefield and accident waiting to happen. Tread lightly.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Family_and_Medical_Leave_Act_o...

Re: The Weird Nerd comes with trade-offs

#152

Post by ThrowawayR2 »

newzisforsukas wrote: post #49
seanmcdirmid wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many weird nerds are on the spectrum and require very good people managers above them to mitigate their quirks, and should never go into people management themselves. The industry has really changed though. It is much easier to hire social well adapted people who can code at all than to hire a bunch of people with social problems who can code really good. The former is scalable at least, the latter breaks down as no…

> The industry has really changed though. It is much easier to hire social well adapted people who can code at all than to hire a bunch of people with social problems who can code really good If you have no financial constraints? In what world do you spend massive amounts of money to mitigate people being "weird"?

The shift to high level languages like COBOL, BASIC, FORTRAN from machine language? The shift to GC languages? The shift to vastly inefficient but easy to use scripting languages like Python? There's a long history of trading off CPU/RAM/storage efficiency (i.e. massive amounts of money) to make computing accessible to less and less nerdy people.

Re: The Weird Nerd comes with trade-offs

#153

Post by lolinder »

programjames wrote: post #132
doug_durham wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The intent is to de-stigmatize the labels. I consider myself a "weird nerd". I find the use of the label affirming. Perhaps ASD or other symptom descriptive way to describing things would be more "correct". However "weird nerd" is what the other parts of society use to describe these terms. Using the term to describe the positive aspects of these symptoms helps to take the sting out.

I think "genius" fits the author's meaning and connotation much better than "weird nerd". If the author wants to fight for genius rights, why start from a position of weakness?

Genius would be a much worse term for what the author is describing because it explicitly doesn't come with trade-offs. The term needs to convey both the unique talents and the odd differences.

"Nerd" has been the subject of a long and largely successful attempt at reclamation, to the point where people younger than a certain age don't generally consider it to be derogatory and comfortably identify with it. It's been so successful that the author feels the need to prepend the word "weird" to clarify that we're not talking about just anyone who likes video games.

Re: The Weird Nerd comes with trade-offs

#154

Post by tomrod »

sneed_chucker wrote: post #67
walt_grata wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I duno on some of that. Until I was about 39 I was a "weird nerd" and then my wife (Dr of special education) finally convinced me to talk to a Dr and get get tested for autism. Turns out I'm ASD 1, would have been Asperger's in the past. Autism has a very wide range of ways it shows itself.

Well, to me your comment also speaks to the increasing degree to which we medicalize personality traits. I'm sure your diagnosis is legitimate, but also I'm inferring from your comment that you are married and gainfully employed; so it sounds like you're able to build and maintain relationships, as well hold conversations with strangers or non-close acquaintances when necessary. In years past would any professional h…

Are you aware that ASD isn't purely psychosocial?

Re: The Weird Nerd comes with trade-offs

#155

Post by seanmcdirmid »

fragmede wrote: post #140
pclmulqdq wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mental illness is somewhat linked to creative productivity, sadly. Bipolar disorder is somewhat overrepresented in highly-accomplished musicians, artists, and writers (with the trend going as far back as the 1800s). It would not surprise me if ASD is overrepresented in scientists and engineers. However, people also imitate their tribe, and seeing "weird nerds" with mental illness may get other nerds to emulate that b…

Or plain just getting away with shitty behavior. Uncle Rick's a raging asshole and we still accept him as part of the family, which means so can I.

Usually people with an uncle Rick don’t want to become like him and are actually more self aware.

Re: The Weird Nerd comes with trade-offs

#156

Post by tomrod »

faeriechangling wrote: post #100
sneed_chucker wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, to me your comment also speaks to the increasing degree to which we medicalize personality traits. I'm sure your diagnosis is legitimate, but also I'm inferring from your comment that you are married and gainfully employed; so it sounds like you're able to build and maintain relationships, as well hold conversations with strangers or non-close acquaintances when necessary. In years past would any professional h…

I don't really accept the validity of people who are generally more functional and conventionally successful than average being called "disordered" in the first place. It seems like a weird arbitrary insistence of the medical system to simply pathologize anybody who fits into a certain box.

I'm glad you aren't a, diagnostician with that bias!

Re: The Weird Nerd comes with trade-offs

#157

Post by AlexandrB »

I think about this all the time in the context of the arts. Kanye, for example, definitely has extremely weird political ideas. He also created Dark Twisted Fantasy. The tolerance for this kind of "troubled genius" is dropping in artistic pursuits too. I wonder if that's why pop culture increasingly feels like a "content" slurry instead of anything identifiable.

Re: The Weird Nerd comes with trade-offs

#158

Post by eikenberry »

Aurornis wrote: post #116
belinder wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just a guess here - but to make diagnosed people feel more included and part of a group, the more people get diagnosed even if it's 0.01%, the more safe the others feel because they're not alone, it stops being a stigma

> but to make diagnosed people feel more included and part of a group, the more people get diagnosed even if it's 0.01%, the more safe the others feel because they're not alone, I've worked with younger people in tech. I'm seeing a mix of effects, positive and negative, from increased diagnosis rates. On the plus side, some people are using their diagnoses to find helpful support material, techniques, and advice. On…

How is this stance different from one that says the same thing about your race or being deaf or requiring regular injections? Seems to me this is saying that some forms of bigotry are OK and the victims of it just need to deal with it. That neural disorders aren't as real or important because you can't see them and that makes it easier for some people who have them, but at a functional level, try to make more of it than they should. Because of this everyone with any level of these conditions should just suck it up where it doesn't jive well with our common hierarchical workplace organization.

Re: The Weird Nerd comes with trade-offs

#159

Post by iamdbtoo »

Aurornis wrote: post #116
belinder wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just a guess here - but to make diagnosed people feel more included and part of a group, the more people get diagnosed even if it's 0.01%, the more safe the others feel because they're not alone, it stops being a stigma

> but to make diagnosed people feel more included and part of a group, the more people get diagnosed even if it's 0.01%, the more safe the others feel because they're not alone, I've worked with younger people in tech. I'm seeing a mix of effects, positive and negative, from increased diagnosis rates. On the plus side, some people are using their diagnoses to find helpful support material, techniques, and advice. On…

> The educational institutions meant well, but the students took the wrong message from their accommodations and assumed it was always the world's responsibility to bend to their personal quirks rather than the other way around.

This is kind of a toxic perspective and could be why you have so many problems with your neurodiverse coworkers. If you believe they should never require accommodations and are always expected to conform to the rest of society, then you don't understand what that experience is like and how further debilitating it can actually be.

Re: The Weird Nerd comes with trade-offs

#160

Post by WereAllMadHere »

faeriechangling wrote: post #100
sneed_chucker wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, to me your comment also speaks to the increasing degree to which we medicalize personality traits. I'm sure your diagnosis is legitimate, but also I'm inferring from your comment that you are married and gainfully employed; so it sounds like you're able to build and maintain relationships, as well hold conversations with strangers or non-close acquaintances when necessary. In years past would any professional h…

I don't really accept the validity of people who are generally more functional and conventionally successful than average being called "disordered" in the first place. It seems like a weird arbitrary insistence of the medical system to simply pathologize anybody who fits into a certain box.

What about someone who needs a wheelchair but is conveniently successful?
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