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Vulkan1.3 on the M1 in one month

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Re: Vulkan1.3 on the M1 in one month

#311

Post by wlesieutre »

shmerl wrote: post #221
wlesieutre wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Haven't tried it, but this person says no https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/1cl0bwn/star_c...

Interesting. Looks like it works but with poor performance. I guess I'll wait for them to finish the rest of the work to enable more parallelism first. Also, did they start using EAC? That usually works very badly in Wine unless developers flip some switch to allow it on their side?

It does have EAC, but I don't think it's as aggressively enforced as some games since people are still able to run it on Linux.

There's a Linux Users Group that would know much more about it than I do.

https://robertsspaceindustries.com/orgs/LUG

Re: Vulkan1.3 on the M1 in one month

#312

Post by kbolino »

rowanG077 wrote: post #182
kbolino wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd love to hear about all these DRM-free single-player AAA games. If you're talking about older games, then maybe we're just talking past each other; I assumed we were talking about recent AAA games.

They don't have to be DRM-free.Here you can play all of these on linux: https://www.protondb.com/explore Highlights include Elden Ring, Baldurs Gate 3 and God of War.

I upvoted for the link, which is useful to me, but I'm not sure this means Steam and all of those games will be able to run on Asahi/M1.

Re: Vulkan1.3 on the M1 in one month

#313

Post by pmarreck »

flohofwoe wrote: post #246
talldayo wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There will be a small bit of irony if the gaming experience on Asahi ends up easier and more straightforward than MacOS. Really just drives home how big of a mistake it was ignoring Vulkan for the past decade on Apple's behalf, but lord knows they won't admit that until it's too late.

Supporting a different 3D API is really not the complicated or time consuming part of porting a game to another platform, especially when the target API is Metal. The poor game support on macOS is a mix of Apple apathy towards gaming and the low potential sales numbers. Also, of the few new Vulkan apps being released (a whopping 9 in 2023), most actually only support a single platform: https://carette.xyz/posts/state…

> the low potential sales numbers

All sales are initially low before a market is grown.

If Apple wanted a machine that was also a great gaming machine, they could have that, and that market would then grow. The fact that they even have a gaming market at all left, shows that the appetite is there. (Of all the machines I have it installed on, Baldur's Gate 3 for example looks best on my Mac screen thanks to the HDR stuff)

Re: Vulkan1.3 on the M1 in one month

#314

Post by rowanG077 »

kbolino wrote: post #312
rowanG077 wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They don't have to be DRM-free.Here you can play all of these on linux: https://www.protondb.com/explore Highlights include Elden Ring, Baldurs Gate 3 and God of War.

I upvoted for the link, which is useful to me, but I'm not sure this means Steam and all of those games will be able to run on Asahi/M1.

No one can look into the future. But Fex + Vulkan definitely have the goal of being able to run those games.

Re: Vulkan1.3 on the M1 in one month

#315

Post by PokestarFan »

crazygringo wrote: post #172
skrrtww wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a bit of a tangential rant, so I apologize. But I recently tried to update Death Stranding, the flagship AAA game that Apple landed on macOS and in the App Store. The game itself is 77.5 GB; it had required a little over 150 GB to install. I shrugged that off at the time; they haven't figured out how to decompress on the fly, whatever. I had about 50GB free on my (1 TB M1 Max) machine at the time of the updat…

Wow. Truly that's bizarre. Clearly the App Store was never meant for distribution of 75 GB games, it's clearly meant for mostly I'm surprised they even allow huge apps like that in the first place, and don't have e.g. a 5 GB hard limit for usability reasons. They should have a limit if they're not going to support patch upgrades. Who the heck has 231 GB free on their Mac internal SSD? Almost nobody. Why would the dev…

Xcode used to be absolutely massive, being 10GB+ a few years back. They seemed to have done a better job at making it smaller.

Re: Vulkan1.3 on the M1 in one month

#316

Post by andrewmcwatters »

exDM69 wrote: post #116

If you're unfamiliar with Vulkan 1.3 but are interested in low level graphics API work, you should check it out. It is a game changer and a huge difference to Vulkan 1.0. Once past the initial hurdle it's a pleasure to work with, with all dynamic states and no render pass up front set up, it is much easier to work with, even easier than OpenGL (which I've used for 20 years). Graphics programming is fun again. It's av…

[flagged]

Re: Vulkan1.3 on the M1 in one month

#317

Post by andrewmcwatters »

hgs3 wrote: post #70
tombert wrote: post #62

A very large part of me is annoyed that Apple didn't open source Metal before Vulkan was released. OpenGL definitely was annoying to work with, but Vulkan is impossible for the average user to do anything with; drawing a spinning cube takes several hundred lines of code, which I've written and I still don't really understand! I realize that Vulkan isn't meant for a "humans" to write, it's basically meant to be a targ…

Please don't misinterpret this as gate keeping, but Vulkan is designed by and for professionals (not hobbyists). It is certainly not a rapid prototyping tool. Vulkan and OpenGL aren't comparable because Vulkan isn't merely a graphics API, but rather it's a low-level GPU API. For example you can use Vulkan in place of CUDA for running highly parallelized computations on the GPU (no graphics implied).

> Please don't misinterpret this as gate keeping, but Vulkan is designed by and for professionals (not hobbyists). It is certainly not a rapid prototyping tool. Vulkan and OpenGL aren't comparable because Vulkan isn't merely a graphics API, but rather it's a low-level GPU API. For example you can use Vulkan in place of CUDA for running highly parallelized computations on the GPU (no graphics implied).

This is bullshit and it doesn't mean anything. In the days of OpenGL, you used the same initialization code regardless if you were a "professional" or a "hobbyist." Code is code.

It especially doesn't mean anything because people use CUDA for CUDA, and want to use Vulkan for graphics because OpenGL has been discontinued.

Re: Vulkan1.3 on the M1 in one month

#318

Post by andrewmcwatters »

jakogut wrote: post #167
galad87 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why Vulkan? Let's implement DirectX directly and call it a day.

There are already high quality implementations of every version of Direct3D released over the past couple decades built on top of Vulkan. Writing a Vulkan driver is purportedly a much easier task than for higher level graphics APIs like Direct3D/OpenGL.

Direct3D 12 is basically Vulkan.

Re: Vulkan1.3 on the M1 in one month

#319

Post by babypuncher »

kbolino wrote: post #149
rowanG077 wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

AAA gaming is THE driving factor for getting Vulkan on Asahi. There really are only a tiny subset of games that require a kernel anti cheat. Let alone the wealth of single player games.

I'd love to hear about all these DRM-free single-player AAA games. If you're talking about older games, then maybe we're just talking past each other; I assumed we were talking about recent AAA games.

Recent AAA games absolutely run on Linux using Proton. DRM isn't really a concern. The biggest and most successful DRM vendor, Denuvo, even goes out of their way to make sure their product does not interfere with Proton compatibility.

It's pretty rare for a new game to come out and not be playable on the Steam Deck within a week if not on day 1. And when that does happen, it's usually a PvP multiplayer game with kernel-level anticheat.

Re: Vulkan1.3 on the M1 in one month

#320

Post by talldayo »

flohofwoe wrote: post #246
talldayo wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There will be a small bit of irony if the gaming experience on Asahi ends up easier and more straightforward than MacOS. Really just drives home how big of a mistake it was ignoring Vulkan for the past decade on Apple's behalf, but lord knows they won't admit that until it's too late.

Supporting a different 3D API is really not the complicated or time consuming part of porting a game to another platform, especially when the target API is Metal. The poor game support on macOS is a mix of Apple apathy towards gaming and the low potential sales numbers. Also, of the few new Vulkan apps being released (a whopping 9 in 2023), most actually only support a single platform: https://carette.xyz/posts/state…

> Apple also offers a D3D12 porting toolkit now

Now they do. After 5 years of people begging them for DXVK, Apple gives us... a downstream fork of DXVK retooled for Metal.

I really just feel bad for Mac owners. Like; you could be playing Apex Legends with us, but can't. Like I said, these changes to Asahi will likely make it easier than MacOS to play games on. Who would use MacOS for gaming when Steam Play works out-of-box on Linux? A masochist, I say.

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