Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Vulkan1.3 on the M1 in one month

rosenzweig.io

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

131–140 of 372 posts

Re: Vulkan1.3 on the M1 in one month

#131

Post by __madness »

delta_p_delta_x wrote: post #86

Hacker News regularly makes me feel very stupid, and none more so than blog posts by Alyssa Rosenzweig. I couldn't even write an engine that used Vulkan in six months, nor a software rasteriser; meanwhile, Alyssa wrote an entire compliant driver on a non-native operating system running on locked-down hardware in one month flat. What am I doing with my life? EDIT: I point this out because I'd eventually like to write…

I sometimes feel like her success is driving me into madness, I feel like Salieri looking at Mozart when I look at her work.

Here is the Alyssa timeline:

* She started programming at ~3 with MIT Scratch. Her Father introduced it to her, he works at Intel and is a very successful person.

* I think around age 11-12 she knew C very well, worked on some low level networking stuff for games, she wanted to make an MMO.

* At 12 she made a project to convert LLVM IR to MIT Scratch.

* She was involved with libreboot, not sure to what degree.

* She was 15 when she worked to the open source RPI firmware.

* Interned at FSF

* I think she was ~16 when she developed the Panfrost GPU driver.

I can't help but wonder how my life would be if I was a native English speaker. Lived in USA and had a great father and mentors like hers. I gave everything to programming, everything I have to give. Wonder if I am hitting the limits of my nature or just had worse nurture.

Re: Vulkan1.3 on the M1 in one month

#132

Post by anyfoo »

htatche wrote: post #120
delta_p_delta_x wrote: post #86

Hacker News regularly makes me feel very stupid, and none more so than blog posts by Alyssa Rosenzweig. I couldn't even write an engine that used Vulkan in six months, nor a software rasteriser; meanwhile, Alyssa wrote an entire compliant driver on a non-native operating system running on locked-down hardware in one month flat. What am I doing with my life? EDIT: I point this out because I'd eventually like to write…

Maybe you’re just enjoying it rather than spending all your waking time writing code?

That's a big assumption. Alyssa may very well not spend all her walking time writing code (setting aside the implication that writing code is not "enjoyable" for now).

Feynman was a very successful physicist. A nobel price medalist, among other things. He very famously was also someone who enjoyed a life outside of physics a great deal.

Paul Erdős, on the other hand, did at least outwardly seem to have spent most of his life focused on doing mathematics. And nobody can convince me that he did not enjoy his life as well...

Re: Vulkan1.3 on the M1 in one month

#133

Post by robertlagrant »

tracker1 wrote: post #101
dagmx wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Okay, so you're counting non-native games when the discussion is AGAIN clearly about native games. If we're talking about translation layers, then it's irrelevant because Whisky/Crossover can run them as well. This is just you being completely disingenuous now and purposefully avoiding the actual point of the discussion.

I think it's absolutely fair to count games that are able to run in Linux with Proton via DXVK + Vulcan. Since it's well established and relatively popular thanks to Valve's efforts with the Steam Deck and Proton. Given those efforts, if Apple/Mac had support for Vulkan, Valve would probably make it all just as available on Mac as they do on Linux for Proton.

Well - they might. I don't think Valve would hate being the gaming gateway for Mac as well as for PC, but they have great Linux support because of the Steam Deck.

Re: Vulkan1.3 on the M1 in one month

#134

Post by anyfoo »

machine_coffee wrote: post #130

Something crashes, it's _never_ a compiler bug ... April 16 Oh, it actually is a compiler bug! Can confidently say I've never experienced one in my career, but at some level of abstraction I guess it's less rare to find them.

It's never a compiler bug, and it's definitely never a CPU bug.

Unless you're a low level kernel developer, then it's both!

(Jokes aside, it's still much, much more often not than it is, but it definitely does happen.)

Re: Vulkan1.3 on the M1 in one month

#135

Post by masto »

delta_p_delta_x wrote: post #86

Hacker News regularly makes me feel very stupid, and none more so than blog posts by Alyssa Rosenzweig. I couldn't even write an engine that used Vulkan in six months, nor a software rasteriser; meanwhile, Alyssa wrote an entire compliant driver on a non-native operating system running on locked-down hardware in one month flat. What am I doing with my life? EDIT: I point this out because I'd eventually like to write…

You think you feel stupid, I don't even know what a Honeykrisp Compliant Vulkan is. Sometimes Hacker News makes me wonder if I've had a stroke.

Re: Vulkan1.3 on the M1 in one month

#136

Post by rowanG077 »

galad87 wrote: post #14
rowanG077 wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If Apple truly wanted that they could simply implement Vulkan.

Why Vulkan? Let's implement DirectX directly and call it a day.

Why would apple Implement an API they have zero control over? That's just stupid. In contrast Apple already is a member of khronos and you get DirectX for free anyway if you have Vulkan due to dxvk. There are only downsides to implementing DirectX.

Re: Vulkan1.3 on the M1 in one month

#137

Post by tombert »

_mlbt wrote: post #115
tombert wrote: post #62

A very large part of me is annoyed that Apple didn't open source Metal before Vulkan was released. OpenGL definitely was annoying to work with, but Vulkan is impossible for the average user to do anything with; drawing a spinning cube takes several hundred lines of code, which I've written and I still don't really understand! I realize that Vulkan isn't meant for a "humans" to write, it's basically meant to be a targ…

I wonder how feasible a Metal compatibility library wrapped around Vulkan would be? That way you could use Metal on other platforms. Also, what is the best resource for learning Metal if all you know is some OpenGL 1.x from the old “Lego” book?

> I wonder how feasible a Metal compatibility library wrapped around Vulkan would be?

Sort of an inverse of the MoltenVK project? I don't see any reason why that would be infeasible other than "no one really wants this but me".

> Also, what is the best resource for learning Metal if all you know is some OpenGL 1.x from the old “Lego” book?

To be clear, I am not a graphics person, I'm a dude who dicks around with graphics occasionally to play with some kind of more graphical algorithm I read about, but I really don't know what I'm talking about.

That said, I went through this book, It's good enough: https://a.co/d/b3yjPMp

A former coworker of mine also wrote this one if you're interested in iOS game dev, though I have not read it so I cannot speak to its quality: https://a.co/d/c99oE0Q

Re: Vulkan1.3 on the M1 in one month

#138

Post by rowanG077 »

kbolino wrote: post #119
galad87 wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's larger than Windows + Xbox + Playstation for AAA games?

No single 3D API is capable of supporting all 3 of those platforms. However, if those are the only 3 you're concerned with, then Direct3D gets you farther (Windows+Xbox) than Vulkan (Windows only). You're still going to have to write/use something different for PlayStation (which has its own custom API). The two major platforms that favor Vulkan are Android and Switch, but the former is in the "mobile" category rathe…

AAA gaming is THE driving factor for getting Vulkan on Asahi. There really are only a tiny subset of games that require a kernel anti cheat. Let alone the wealth of single player games.

Re: Vulkan1.3 on the M1 in one month

#139

Post by mardifoufs »

tapoxi wrote: post #69
LucidLynx wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The number of games that run natively on Vulkan is negligible. Yep, that's unfortunately true... https://www.carette.xyz/posts/state_of_vulkan_2024/

Why is this article comparing game engines with games?

What do you mean? I guess most engines support Vulkan but that's not the point of the article, but you might be referring to something else.

Re: Vulkan1.3 on the M1 in one month

#140

Post by troupo »

talldayo wrote: post #4
dagmx wrote: post #2

Very impressive work, and a great testament to the value of shared, iterative and open components. I'll be curious how long it takes Proton to be ported, though I suspect even with an optimal Vk implementation, many games will run terribly due to the difference in GPU architecture + arm translation overhead + proton itself (however negligible). Still, I remain optimistic that more games will target unified memory and…

There will be a small bit of irony if the gaming experience on Asahi ends up easier and more straightforward than MacOS. Really just drives home how big of a mistake it was ignoring Vulkan for the past decade on Apple's behalf, but lord knows they won't admit that until it's too late.

> Really just drives home how big of a mistake it was ignoring Vulkan for the past decade on Apple's behalf, but lord knows they won't admit that until it's too late.

People who keep saying this have surprisingly short/bad memories. And very little idea of the state of the industry.

- Apple already shipped Metal version 1 a full year before Vulkan was even an idea. iPhone, one of the largest casual gaming platforms in the world, is Metal

- Windows and Xbox is DirectX

- Playstation is their own thing (keep forgetting what it's called)

That leaves Android (mostly underpowered and fractured to even run games properly) and Switch who really support Vulkan.

Post reply on HN