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Apple signs deal with OpenAI for iOS, still wants Google as an 'option'

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Re: Apple signs deal with OpenAI for iOS, still wants Google as an 'option'

#21
post #11

I guess unfortunately Apple has no choice but to include bullshit AI in it's products and services or look like they have been left behind.

I don’t think Siri but as an LLM would be “bullshit.” It’d be an absolutely immense upgrade.

What would you be using it for? More and more I fail to see the value in LLMs. Something like Copilot, if used correctly, does have a bit of usefulness, but that's really the main use case right now. You can't trust the LLMs, so you can't use them for anything where you aren't going to go through the output meticulously afterwards.

Then again, I don't see the point in Siri either, it's useful in only a handful of cases.

Re: Apple signs deal with OpenAI for iOS, still wants Google as an 'option'

#22

I guess unfortunately Apple has no choice but to include bullshit AI in it's products and services or look like they have been left behind.

Apple should consider an iPhone/iOS light, a version stripped of anything but the bare essentials. I get why they don't, the market isn't big enough, and they can barely sell their current best phone, the iPhone SE.

Re: Apple signs deal with OpenAI for iOS, still wants Google as an 'option'

#23
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hallucinations would be terrible for brand appeal beyond being limited. Nobody has solved that problem yet. Just take a look at Google’s latest search results giving actively harmful information.

I suspect that current ML tech is good enough to constitute a big discrete step forward in terms of how much value Siri is providing as a digital assistant that's also in charge of your home. If that's the case, there's more harm in being reputed as the company that is one serious step behind in a space that isn't yet settled vs facing the same level of gaffs that Google and Microsoft are putting out. Just look at Mi…

I would argue that Microsoft do not have the same brand that Apple does. So they’re much more free to pursue OpenAI partnerships regardless of how well it works.

I don’t mean brand as in purely recognition, but what it means to people. Apple are held to a higher standard because of the specific identity they’ve cultivated. (Arguing the specifics of whether that’s deserved or not will be its own essay so I’m leaving that out)

You see this all the time on HN or Reddit, where any negative subject about Apple gains significantly more traction than other companies.

Meanwhile Microsoft has an identify that is more “meh”. Users expect Microsoft products to not have the polish, to have ads and be weird/quirky. Microsoft did Windows phone and the zune, Apple did the iPhone and the iPod.

Does that mean one companies products are better or worse? Maybe? Maybe not.

But it does mean that the brand appeal of every company has different characteristics that need to be accounted for. Siri giving bad answers is much worse perceptually than Cortana/Bing giving the same answers.

It also means Microsoft is more free to experiment and do things that are half baked because their brand identity allows for that. Often that leads to really interesting use cases ahead of its time.

I’d also add that Apple being “behind the curve” perceptually has rarely been an issue. The brand is that they enter late and redefine the segment. Again, not always deserved, but that’s the association. They often ride out trends that way.

Re: Apple signs deal with OpenAI for iOS, still wants Google as an 'option'

#24
post #16
post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t think Siri but as an LLM would be “bullshit.” It’d be an absolutely immense upgrade.

Hallucinations would be terrible for brand appeal beyond being limited. Nobody has solved that problem yet. Just take a look at Google’s latest search results giving actively harmful information.

It can't be any worse than how bad Siri and Alexa are right now. Amazon gave me one of those Pop things recently and it was set up with the wrong zip code. I kept asking it for the weather in Chicago, every way that I could think of, but it had no idea what I was trying to ask for. The speaker is great in it, though.

Re: Apple signs deal with OpenAI for iOS, still wants Google as an 'option'

#26

I guess unfortunately Apple has no choice but to include bullshit AI in it's products and services or look like they have been left behind.

Came to say the same. My gut tells me they wouldn't go anywhere near this unless they were concerned to be seen not getting on the bandwagon. It is worrying that "AI" (read silly LLM toys) has become so prevalent that they need to do this.

Re: Apple signs deal with OpenAI for iOS, still wants Google as an 'option'

#27
post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t think Siri but as an LLM would be “bullshit.” It’d be an absolutely immense upgrade.

What would you be using it for? More and more I fail to see the value in LLMs. Something like Copilot, if used correctly, does have a bit of usefulness, but that's really the main use case right now. You can't trust the LLMs, so you can't use them for anything where you aren't going to go through the output meticulously afterwards. Then again, I don't see the point in Siri either, it's useful in only a handful of cas…

I went back to iOS recently, and with AirPods or CarPlay, I found Siri to be a really pleasant surprise. If I need something done, like a text message sent or a quick calculation done, I can just ask without taking my hands or eyes off what I’m doing. It’s also gotten a lot better at taking the hot word + command + arguments without breaks. “hey siri, send a message to dan I’m here” gets you “to dan: I’m here, send it?” For CarPlay, “hey siri, navigate to xyz restaurant” works great to start the navigation if you change your mind about where you’re going once you’re already on the road.

Combine that with “announce notifications” and it really feels like the future, “dan says, are you on your way” and it listens for a few seconds, where you can just say “reply yep I’m 15 minutes away”.

They’re already bringing AI into it a bit, if you get a picture it will try to describe what’s happening in the picture “dan sent a photo of a piece of paper with text on it” which is interesting but it’s not getting enough detail in the descriptions to be of much use just yet. A good multimodal model could definitely improve that, though it must be noted I prefer a worse on-device model to a server based model that can collect a bunch of data.

I think for really off the wall questions/brainstorming, going out to an LLM would yield better results than the current behavior of pointing you towards Google in the browser. “hey siri, what are the typical speeds people achieve on a SPI bus” would be nice if it could give some answer even if it’s not always 100% perfect, it’s kinda like bouncing questions off a slightly unreliable coworker, but you know, better than nothing when you can do it hands/eyes free.

I also have a hope that AI (although maybe not specifically LLMs) would help these assistants handle more complex tasks, like “add eggs to my grocery list” where your grocery list is just in a note and not in some special place. It doesn’t feel out of the question given current technology, I just think nobody’s done it yet.

Re: Apple signs deal with OpenAI for iOS, still wants Google as an 'option'

#29

What does this mean for Apple’s product positioning on privacy?

Probably OpenAI giving the whole direct model(s) to Apple like how you could download LLAMA3 locally. It'd be up to Apple to build the infrastructure to run it at scale for their billions of devices.
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