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Bossware is a big legal risk

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Re: Bossware is a big legal risk

#141

Post by LiquidSky »

Dalewyn wrote: post #118
paxys wrote: post #57

Everyone replying with "what's the big deal?" is showing their tech privilege. You may not have to deal with intrusive monitoring, but warehouse workers are increasingly being made to wear ankle bracelets so every movement of theirs can be monitored and stack ranked. Workers in WFH "gig" jobs are made to install always-on keyloggers and other monitoring software on their personal computers and phones (which are requi…

>install always-on keyloggers and other monitoring software on their personal computers and phones 1. WTF is anyone doing using their personal belongings for their work? Cleanly and clearly demarcating personal and professional is CYA 101, for both employee and employer. 2. WTF is the employer doing if they don't provide all necessary tooling for the job prescribed? 3. WTF are you doing working for above employer? I…

3. WTF are you doing working for above employer? I sympathize not everyone can do so, but the only way such bullshit will change is if enough of the workforce says "nope" and quits for greener pastures.

...this is exactly what the parent comment is talking about. People take these jobs because you need money to live and not everyone has the luxury of being able to turn down jobs with shitty conditions. Employers take advantage of this and do things like require their employees to use their personal belongings.

1. WTF is anyone doing using their personal belongings for their work? Cleanly and clearly demarcating personal and professional is CYA 101, for both employee and employer.

2. WTF is the employer doing if they don't provide all necessary tooling for the job prescribed?

Because then they don't have to spend any company money.

Re: Bossware is a big legal risk

#142

Post by VBprogrammer »

coldtea wrote: post #67
VBprogrammer wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Emm, yes? What do you think they are going to do with it. They are also considering giving you access to potentially a vast amount of their IP and maybe even customer data.

> Emm, yes? What do you think they are going to do with it I don't care what they're going to do with it. They aint having it.

I just don't understand this at all. Perhaps if they said they intended to record the interview I'd be a little uncomfortable. Otherwise, did you hide your identity in face to face interviews? Do you refuse to enter buildings with CCTV?

I've interviewed hundreds of people since COVID / interviews going online. I'm not aware that it's been a problem for a single candidate, I don't even think we say it explicitly.

Re: Bossware is a big legal risk

#144

Post by adapiz »

quectophoton wrote: post #115
paxys wrote: post #57

Everyone replying with "what's the big deal?" is showing their tech privilege. You may not have to deal with intrusive monitoring, but warehouse workers are increasingly being made to wear ankle bracelets so every movement of theirs can be monitored and stack ranked. Workers in WFH "gig" jobs are made to install always-on keyloggers and other monitoring software on their personal computers and phones (which are requi…

Last year when I started looking for jobs I landed a job in a company that did consulting services. All looked fine on the outside, but when I joined I found out they are doing software for this kind of stalking, and even use AI to classify employees as "productive", "not productive", and other criteria based on their computer's activity. I noped the hell out of there without even having spent a week working for them…

Thanks to the article I now have the proper word for it: Bossware. I feel reminded of Ploito. It got advertised on HN. 6 months later I'm sure: It was an ad to gain attention. Idk what happened but it seems that the poster and their business owner became very silent 2 months after their pitch. It's still worth to quote the BO > "weed out the lazy and deceitful, thereby forming a healthy and efficient team." It's bossware disguised as a "cool" product to connect teams. You could say it's a Trojan horse. Sure the monitoring is all "optional" but the mentality is baked into the product.

For me it's just right to reject every potential company installing bossware alone for your personal health. People burn out under constant monitoring forced to be 100% productive all day. Have a bad day? Sad for you, it lowers your numbers. Sick leave instead? "Oh what a weak person, how unreliable". People with utilizing computers to effectively slave-drive people should be held responsible for the damage they cause. They should pay for the treatment if they drive people into depressions and burnout and neither health insurances or the society.

Re: Bossware is a big legal risk

#145

Post by [deleted] »

bitwize wrote: post #92
singleshot_ wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wouldn’t accept that either. I’ll bring my own computer and then we don’t have to worry about your stupid spyware games. The attitude of some employers is very poor.

Due to security restrictions, any device you bring to work to use for Company purposes is subject to the IT Acceptable Use Policy and you consent to allow Company to take whatever measures it deems necessary to protect its data including, but not limited to, network monitoring and mandatory installation of endpoint security software. I haven't seen this implemented for developer workstations; generally BYOD is forbid…

[deleted]

Re: Bossware is a big legal risk

#146

Post by meepmorp »

tiahura wrote: post #126
Terr_ wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> At this point it looks like it’ll be iris scans. Oh god no, a piece of not-that-secret information which can't be revoked when eventually leaked. "This is a courtesy alert that your iris scan has been found on the darkweb..."

Like your name or address?

You can change your name and address, you cannot change your irises.

Re: Bossware is a big legal risk

#148

Post by saagarjha »

ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #8
triyambakam wrote: post #2

So how do I know if my work computer features such surveillance?

That's a big reason that I purchased my own, personal computer, many years ago. I was paid well enough, that it was quite possible. Back then, they hadn't really gotten going with all the monitoring stuff, but I did it from a sense of personal integrity. I was writing open-source stuff, and there was no way that I was going to allow my company to try to claim it. I didn't use company time, and I didn't use company eq…

Are you a contractor? This makes things a lot easier. For salaried employees that kind of agreement is far more common :(

Re: Bossware is a big legal risk

#149

Post by saagarjha »

whoitwas wrote: post #133
davely wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No kidding! We have some ridiculous timeout on our work machines that triggers the screensaver after 2 minutes of idle time (we can’t change this). After it’s triggered, you need to enter your password to unlock (company mandated, 10 chars minimum, no repeating chars, at least 1 upper and 1 lower case char, at least 1 special symbol, change every 90 days, can't be too similar to last 10(!) passwords). Okay, this is a…

I alias a script to run caffeinate. They aren't going to mess with your terminal processes. https://ss64.com/mac/caffeinate.html

pkill -9 caffeinate seems pretty reasonable for them to start doing

Re: Bossware is a big legal risk

#150

Post by saagarjha »

exabrial wrote: post #14
BriggyDwiggs42 wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because workers arent slaves or robots, and being on the job doesnt make them such. Your mentality is actually staggering to me.

Can you answer this question directly: What is it that you don't want seen by a company representative, on a company computer, while being paid by the company?

I don't really need my company's IT team looking at the meetings I'm booking with the therapist on my employer-sponsored healthcare plan, for example
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