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Neighbors Are Retiring in Their 30s. Why Can't You?

nytimes.com

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Re: Neighbors Are Retiring in Their 30s. Why Can't You?

#41

Post by devbent »

secabeen wrote: post #38
devbent wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This is a ridiculous exaggeration. No it is not. Given the current tuition rates of state colleges, and factoring the average increases in tuition over the past 10-15 years, it is expected that public universities will have an average 4 year tuition of over 300k in 18 years. Note that some private universities are already at this price!

Yes, it is. See pg 18 here: https://research.collegeboard.org/media/pdf/Trends%20Report%... Actual tuition and fees paid have dropped in real dollars over the last 20 years. Nameplate tuition is meaningless as the average student pays less than $5,000 in tuition at 4-year public schools. The average student gets more than $8k in grants. Room and board remains high, but still nothing near 300k. If you have citations s…

> Nameplate tuition is meaningless as the average student pays less than $5,000 in tuition at 4-year public schools.

The problem here is any parents capable of saving 30k a year for college are in an income bracket that instantly disqualifies their kids from getting any tuition assistance.

Heck back in 2002 I had a mom who drove a school bus and a dad retired on disability and they made enough money between them that I qualified for 0 assistance. We were very much "working class".

I just checked my local public university (University of Washington) and they list out of state costs as around 64k a year. 22k of that is non-tuition related expenses.

The university of Austin is 66k for 2 semesters. That will easily be 400k+ total for a bachelors in a other 18 years.

> Note that I'm looking for actual tuition net of grant-based financial aid for middle class families,

Not relevant to my situation. My wife and I make enough money that we cannot count on our son getting any assistance.

Also your entire premise is easily falsified by the number of students taking out large student loans. If the average tuition is only 5k, we wouldn't have a student loan problem in this country.

The same college board organization says students graduate with an average debt of 29,400.

Other sources (https://educationdata.org/average-student-loan-debt) say students average over 33k of loans to graduate.

If college really only cost 5k a semester, that doesn't seem right. Baristas could literally pay their way through college with zero debt. Heck one good summer internship at a large company would pay for all of college.

Re: Neighbors Are Retiring in Their 30s. Why Can't You?

#42

Post by inemesitaffia »

ChuckMcM wrote: post #5

The article seriously downplays the role of luck here but it isn't wrong. If you live judiciously and save as much as you can by doing so, you reach a point where you can live judiciously without going into the office every day. The common thread is that just because you can buy something, or can qualify for a particular mortgage, doesn't mean you should if you're goal is to "retire" early. One of the engineers I wor…

So many use it to criticize others.

Losing money or net worth as evidence of moral turpitude

Re: Neighbors Are Retiring in Their 30s. Why Can't You?

#43

Post by flandish »

ChuckMcM wrote: post #5

The article seriously downplays the role of luck here but it isn't wrong. If you live judiciously and save as much as you can by doing so, you reach a point where you can live judiciously without going into the office every day. The common thread is that just because you can buy something, or can qualify for a particular mortgage, doesn't mean you should if you're goal is to "retire" early. One of the engineers I wor…

My stepdad saved, as much as he could, so he and my mom could enjoy at the level or slightly less, retired 18 months ago and was proud. Retired at 71. Died this January past. Got less than 2 years.

Thanks Capitalism!

Re: Neighbors Are Retiring in Their 30s. Why Can't You?

#44

Post by dmichulke »

swarnie wrote: post #30
dmichulke wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> at $300-400k in college tuition I always wonder why it doesn't make sense to just have them learn German or French and then have them study in continental Europe. Living standard is the same, tuition cost is mostly non-existent and living abroad, if just for a year, will make you a better person. Total cost for a bachelor + master is maybe 5 years with a cost of 1.5k per month maximum (this is considered rich for s…

By that justification you can skip the French/German stick with English and study at better universities in the UK. Its not free but $25k a year for four years sure beats that 300-400k estimate.

In principal, yes.

As to my book,

- I'm not sure whether 1500$ is good enough in London

- you'll skip the foreign language learning (a time-wise plus AND a minus in terms of culture and, possibly, open-mindedness)

- we're still talking 100k$ of difference for a few ranks higher (top 10 instead of top 30 among maybe 500 good ones)

Re: Neighbors Are Retiring in Their 30s. Why Can't You?

#46

Post by gnicholas »

citizen_friend wrote: post #23
gnicholas wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This surely helps. Until your kids are 5 or so, you don't know if you'll have huge birth-related medical bills, unexpected disabilities/chronic illnesses, or special needs that require moving to an expensive school district. And even assuming everything is good on that front, you're still looking at $300-400k in college tuition (in 2024 dollars) if you let your kids pick any school. You can tell them that you can onl…

> $300-400k in college tuition This is a ridiculous exaggeration.

Vanderbilt hit $100k recently, and most competitive schools cost over $75k. You don’t know when you’re 40 if your 5 year old is going to want to go to one of them.

Re: Neighbors Are Retiring in Their 30s. Why Can't You?

#47

Post by gnicholas »

secabeen wrote: post #38
devbent wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This is a ridiculous exaggeration. No it is not. Given the current tuition rates of state colleges, and factoring the average increases in tuition over the past 10-15 years, it is expected that public universities will have an average 4 year tuition of over 300k in 18 years. Note that some private universities are already at this price!

Yes, it is. See pg 18 here: https://research.collegeboard.org/media/pdf/Trends%20Report%... Actual tuition and fees paid have dropped in real dollars over the last 20 years. Nameplate tuition is meaningless as the average student pays less than $5,000 in tuition at 4-year public schools. The average student gets more than $8k in grants. Room and board remains high, but still nothing near 300k. If you have citations s…

The thing is, if you have a nest egg big enough to FIRE, colleges won’t consider you “middle class”. They’ll consider you loaded and expect you to pay full freight.

Re: Neighbors Are Retiring in Their 30s. Why Can't You?

#48

Post by gnicholas »

bombcar wrote: post #27
gnicholas wrote: post #9

> recommended employing your children starting from the age they are able to do household chores, which offers a double benefit of reducing a parent’s taxable income while building an investment-accruing tax shelter for the 7-year-old In case anyone was wondering, you cannot reduce your taxable income by paying your child to clean your house (I am a former tax lawyer). Could you pay your teenager to work for your com…

The main goal with the “hire children” discussions I’ve seen is to lodge taxable income to the child so you can start investment/retirement accounts. But there are other ways to do the same thing.

One problem with this is that we have no idea what the tax code will look like in 50+ years, when the kid is pulling money out. It’s quite possible that Roth accounts (which are funded with post tax contributions) will no longer be tax free for withdrawals, for example. I could easily see this being walked back for high-income folks, as a way to pay off the enormous debt we are currently incurring.

Re: Neighbors Are Retiring in Their 30s. Why Can't You?

#49

Post by hi-v-rocknroll »

I heard s/Neighbors/grandparent's neighbors' kids/ from age 19 onwards, such as independent corporate tax accountants and startup neighbor. It was expected that I should've been a billionaire by 31 or otherwise I was a disappointment and failure. Anyone can readily hazard a guess how well that worked out.

In the end: money doesn't buy life, imagination, happiness, prestige, or satisfaction, but it buys some freedom. While you'll never get meaningfully rich working for someone else, it is far steadier (usually) but it doesn't include a retirement plan anymore. And, current wages are insufficient to create the same standard of living as previous generations (example: I would need $400k TC to live where my grandparents lived).

Re: Neighbors Are Retiring in Their 30s. Why Can't You?

#50

Post by [deleted] »

ChuckMcM wrote: post #5

The article seriously downplays the role of luck here but it isn't wrong. If you live judiciously and save as much as you can by doing so, you reach a point where you can live judiciously without going into the office every day. The common thread is that just because you can buy something, or can qualify for a particular mortgage, doesn't mean you should if you're goal is to "retire" early. One of the engineers I wor…

[deleted]
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