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Google workers fired for protesting Israeli contract file NLRB complaint

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Re: Google workers fired for protesting Israeli contract file NLRB complaint

#301

Post by cad31 »

linearrust wrote: post #242

What a difference a few years makes. Top comment here : "Don’t do it at work." Top comment a few years ago : "If you work at Google and you have participated in this protest: Thank you." https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17776276 The comments back then were very supportive of google employees protesting against china's censorship. While the top comments here seem to be against google employees protesting israeli w…

This has nothing to do with "a few years", and has everything to do with Israel being perceived as a US ally and China being perceived as an enemy. Basically nothing has changed.

Re: Google workers fired for protesting Israeli contract file NLRB complaint

#302

Post by _heimdall »

DangitBobby wrote: post #291
llm_nerd wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the video I link at the base of this thread multiple participants declare that they did not expect to get fired. They don't call their firing consequences, they call it retaliation. They end the video by declaring that they should all be reinstated because they did nothing wrong. Loads of internet posters very strongly and emotionally declared that they all knew that they'd be fired, including in this thread. That…

> They don't call their firing consequences, they call it retaliation. Well, it is retaliation. The consequences were retaliation by Google. It's maybe just not prohibited retaliation under the law.

What's the difference in retaliation and consequences?

IMO it'd have to be something related to whether the response from Google could have reasonably been expected given the rules, employee agreement, etc. If the protests were disrupting others from getting their job done, that seems pretty reasonable to me personally. Otherwise I guess it would come down to how strict Google has historically been for people ducking out of work without notice (that's the best I could see Google claiming if it really was a peaceful protest / sit-in).

Re: Google workers fired for protesting Israeli contract file NLRB complaint

#303

Post by cad31 »

araes wrote: post #251
reactordev wrote: post #30

Rule number one of being a rebel. Don’t do it at work. Protest all you want in the public streets where you have freedom of assembly. You do NOT have that freedom within a corporate office building. Regardless of employer. A few firings and maybe they’ll get the message to take it outside. I empathize with people wanting to speak out over something they are passionate about. I do this often. Just know your venue and…

> Rule number one of being a rebel. Don't work for the Empire.

Let me fix this for you

> Rule number one of being a rebel

Work for the Empire. Just don't be surprised when you get fired, but complain about it anyway, because why not.

Re: Google workers fired for protesting Israeli contract file NLRB complaint

#304

Post by smsm42 »

racional wrote: post #284
worried4future wrote: post #9

The meat of it is here: > Google “retaliated against approximately 50 employees and interfered with their Section 7 rights by terminating and/or placing them on administrative leave in response to their protected concerted activity, namely, participation (or perceived participation) in a peaceful, non-disruptive protest that was directly and explicitly connected to their terms and conditions of work,” the complaint r…

This is a gross misreading of what the article actually said. The real meat the article (as reflected very clearly in its original title, not the mangled caption that was unfortunately used for the post; and throughout the article body itself) is that Google apparently fired some 20+ employees who either weren't involved the protest at all, or whose alleged participation remains unclear. As if the higher-ups got toge…

> who either weren't involved the protest at all,

Or at least they say that. Which may or may not be true. Maybe google is lying, maybe they are lying. I imagine if NLRB asks, Google will be willing to provide the grounds for firing and we'd know who is the liar here.

Re: Google workers fired for protesting Israeli contract file NLRB complaint

#305

Post by cad31 »

Centigonal wrote: post #3

> This is a marked departure from the way Google has handled employee dissent in the past. In 2018, more than 600 Google workers signed an open letter opposing Project Dragonfly, an effort to build a search engine for China. As The Verge reported at the time, the petition began with an internally shared Google Doc, and all subsequent steps were also organized using Google products. Employees also urged Google to drop…

Dammit this is so dumb. Half of google employees I know are literally racist against Chinese people. This is about China vs Israel, not a change in approach.

Re: Google workers fired for protesting Israeli contract file NLRB complaint

#306

Post by smsm42 »

racional wrote: post #295
worried4future wrote: post #285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Google apparently fired some 20+ employees who either weren't involved the protest at all, or whose alleged participation remains unclear Maybe that's true, maybe it's not, but there is deep information asymmetry here and google has all the advantage and must have anticipated that this would end up in discovery and litigation and that the records of the terminated people's employment would be subject to it. That me…

I have a hard time believing that google would have fired people where the sum of their recorded actions couldn't be reasonably construed to be disruptive. From the article: “When I got there, there were probably 20-ish people sitting on the floor. I didn’t talk to any of them, I talked to folks who were standing up, passing out flyers, doing other roles,” he said, adding that the protesters were wearing matching T-s…

Maybe that what's happened. Or maybe this person forgot to mention some details about something else they did at that day, due to a random lapse of memory without doubt. The point is we have no way to know, based on the words of one, very non-disinterested, side.

Re: Google workers fired for protesting Israeli contract file NLRB complaint

#307

Post by jimbob45 »

racional wrote: post #295
worried4future wrote: post #285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Google apparently fired some 20+ employees who either weren't involved the protest at all, or whose alleged participation remains unclear Maybe that's true, maybe it's not, but there is deep information asymmetry here and google has all the advantage and must have anticipated that this would end up in discovery and litigation and that the records of the terminated people's employment would be subject to it. That me…

I have a hard time believing that google would have fired people where the sum of their recorded actions couldn't be reasonably construed to be disruptive. From the article: “When I got there, there were probably 20-ish people sitting on the floor. I didn’t talk to any of them, I talked to folks who were standing up, passing out flyers, doing other roles,” he said, adding that the protesters were wearing matching T-s…

I wish we had a HN equivalent for the HR crowd because I find situations like this fascinating. HR is going to have to come up with a policy for how coworkers interact with protesters without getting fired because some level of interaction is necessary. If someone is in your office, you're going to need a "Hey, what's going on?", "Can you move over a bit so I can sit at my desk?", and "So what are you guys protesting?". A blanket ban on all interaction won't work because guys like this will get canned but by the same token, you can't have people toeing the line going in and out and pretending to interact so they can stay in the area without having their jobs threatened.

Re: Google workers fired for protesting Israeli contract file NLRB complaint

#308

Post by smsm42 »

siva7 wrote: post #147

> “There’s been a total change in the way Google responds to employees trying to have a voice in their workplace,” the fired software engineer said. “It’s night and day from the Google of even five, 10 years ago.” Having a political voice is different than having a voice against sexual harassment at the workplace. Please don't mix things that don't belong together. Radically expressing your political voice during you…

> Radically expressing your political voice during your job duties will get you fired in almost all companies

That very much depends on which political voice it is. If it's within approved voices, which lies very heavily to the left, then you'll be likely celebrated. But if you take it too far left - or, horrible dictu, a little to the right - then you'd get the boot. It's been like this 10 years ago and is now, it's just now the incessant push to the left is temporarily diverging from what Google approves, and also the tolerance for physically disruptive actions seems to thin out - while the left seems to get more and more bold, graduating from writing letters to physically disrupting work. The combination of non-approved cause and physical disruption is a sure recipe to get the boot, indeed.

Re: Google workers fired for protesting Israeli contract file NLRB complaint

#309

Post by userbinator »

camdenreslink wrote: post #187
reactordev wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So long as they never mention why they are a former Google employee. Instead of a current one.

I think it really depends on the company. There are a lot of companies out there with a wide range of values. Some might even consider this a quality that they want in a candidate (it will certainly eliminate them from consideration for some companies though).

I doubt the majority of companies will consider it desirable even if they happen to be in political agreement with you --- because people's beliefs change over time.

Re: Google workers fired for protesting Israeli contract file NLRB complaint

#310

Post by cad31 »

relaxing wrote: post #46
manlobster wrote: post #16

Googler protests in the past have typically been walk-outs and other outdoor gatherings. This protest took place within the offices. Some of the protestors occupied senior executives' offices for many hours, and had to be removed by the police. Some of the protestors also streamed their protest from within the offices of the notoriously confidentiality-obsessed company. I don't buy the narrative that Google is cracki…

The idea that live streaming the protests was going to leak corporate secrets is also laughable.

This idea that projects are "confidential" is a classic for keeping employees on their toes and preventing them from asking questions.
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