Jeez, the stretch to the furthest thumb keys is an RSI injury waiting to happen.
Principles for Keyboard Layouts (2022)
61–70 of 106 posts
Re: Principles for Keyboard Layouts (2022)
#62Here are my personal principals: 1. Don't use too many thumb buttons, especially at odd angles, they just make my thumbs hurt after too much typing. 2. Don't use layers for any frequently used buttons, having to keep a button held for a while frequently just leads to more pain. 3. Function keys are mandatory. They aren't used frequently enough that having them in a "far" location is a problem, but when I do use them…
1. More thumb buttons = more better, only if they are placed well (extremely close to the bottom row of the alpha keys.
2. Layers are fine for frequently used keys if activated by the thumb. I have backspace, delete, numbers (home row), symbols, punctuation, and the f keys on layers.
3. Yes.
4. Vim is the answer.
Re: Principles for Keyboard Layouts (2022)
#63Earlier quoted context omitted.
How are you doing layers? I have zero pain problems holding the delete key (on my Kinesis Advantage) to shift into my second layer for things like (,),{,}. It's way less pain then the using a typical keyboard layout. Hell it's easier than actual Shift. I think your other principles are pretty personal. I obviously never use delete. Rarely use function keys or home/end/etc. I use cursor keys a bunch but the Kinesis ha…
> How are you doing layers? With my thumb, since I'd need the other fingers to reach the actual buttons on the layer (usually). Sadly, this breaks my other principals so it doesn't work well for me. Not sure where you delete key is, but I guess it might work well with a pinky key instead (like I can use ctrl+something), but I don't really have a key like that I'd be willing to give up :) > I think your other principl…
Delete is on the left thumb cluster on the Kinesis Advantage. Would it be better if it was something like a toggle like Caps Lock?
Re: Principles for Keyboard Layouts (2022)
#64The layout in the article is on a split ortho keyboard and I think this is the best arrangement for a modern keyboard. What I think is not so obvious is, that the staggering makes traditional non-split keyboards bearable, because it allows to touch type with both hands at a slight angle. At least this is true when using the European fingering. In the US version the number row is awkward to type with angled hands.
I tried switching to an ortholinear keyboard and found it ergonomically unbearable, even after tweaking the layout. My fingers DO NOT move in straight lines when I extend them! They are significantly farther apart when extended than they are contracted.
I was appalled when I found out most people who think ortholinear keyboards are an improvement have been typing Z with their little fingers instead of their ring fingers, X with their ring fingers instead of their middle fingers, etc. Sure, ortholinear is an improvement on that disaster of a hand position! But that's a terrible way to type, so not a good thing to compare to!
I'm baffled that people have enjoyed the experience. To me it felt like a torture device.
Re: Principles for Keyboard Layouts (2022)
#65I would like to see something that records your keystrokes and gives you stats on what you type the most. Then spits out a keyboard arrangement to start from. Not sure how you'd get around it being a huge security risk? Maybe only write totals for keypresses every 30 minutes? Edited to add: Does anyone daily-drive a Keyboardio Model 100? I really liked the concept and participated in the kickstarter, but unfortunatel…
>gives you stats You might enjoy toying around with this: https://patorjk.com/keyboard-layout-analyzer Config in the top right lets you load other layouts.
It also has a “personalized layout”, though when I tried it a few years ago (using a chapter from a novel I wrote as input), I was unimpressed and stuck with Colemak.
Re: Principles for Keyboard Layouts (2022)
#66I settled on Workman 8 years ago, as the methodology behind it seemed pretty sensible. It's definitely nicer to type on than qwerty, IMO. I do however notice occasionally that some words are skewed to a particular hand. It definitely doesn't plague me, nor is it enough of a bother that I have even looked at other layouts. I wonder if it's even possible to adjust the layout to improve this, or does the same problem ju…
I use Workman as well. I tried Colemak (a bunch of variants) and it never sat well with me. There are some words on Workman that hammer the same hand. "People" is one that trips me up sometimes that is very common. Overall, I like Workman too
Re: Principles for Keyboard Layouts (2022)
#67Here are my personal principals: 1. Don't use too many thumb buttons, especially at odd angles, they just make my thumbs hurt after too much typing. 2. Don't use layers for any frequently used buttons, having to keep a button held for a while frequently just leads to more pain. 3. Function keys are mandatory. They aren't used frequently enough that having them in a "far" location is a problem, but when I do use them…
I found that layer on thumb + cursor keys on home row is really pleasing to use. It's like having a better HJKL working in all programs. See https://github.com/FrameworkComputer/qmk_firmware/tree/maste...
Yes! I have a layer accessible by a press and hold on my keyboard (mostly qwerty layout) that gives me arrow keys under FDSE, PgUp/Down and Home/End on 4,R,5,T. It also has custom chords of ctrl + shift, ctrl, alt+shift, alt on the Tab, Capslock, Q, A keys.
Really useful.
Re: Principles for Keyboard Layouts (2022)
#68I settled on Workman 8 years ago, as the methodology behind it seemed pretty sensible. It's definitely nicer to type on than qwerty, IMO. I do however notice occasionally that some words are skewed to a particular hand. It definitely doesn't plague me, nor is it enough of a bother that I have even looked at other layouts. I wonder if it's even possible to adjust the layout to improve this, or does the same problem ju…
I found Workman horrible for same-letter bigrams. After testing a lot of different layouts I've settled on a slightly modified Colemak-DH.
Do you mean same-finger bigrams? I can't think of how same-letter bigrams could have an effect on layout preference.
Re: Principles for Keyboard Layouts (2022)
#69The layout in the article is on a split ortho keyboard and I think this is the best arrangement for a modern keyboard. What I think is not so obvious is, that the staggering makes traditional non-split keyboards bearable, because it allows to touch type with both hands at a slight angle. At least this is true when using the European fingering. In the US version the number row is awkward to type with angled hands.
I tried switching to an ortholinear keyboard and found it ergonomically unbearable, even after tweaking the layout. My fingers DO NOT move in straight lines when I extend them! They are significantly farther apart when extended than they are contracted. I was appalled when I found out most people who think ortholinear keyboards are an improvement have been typing Z with their little fingers instead of their ring fing…
I totally agree. Ortholinear keyboards have crap ergonomics.
Column stagger is what you want, and maybe even a concave keyboard.
Re: Principles for Keyboard Layouts (2022)
#70I spent a lot of time on this, back in my bored 20's. A super-optimized keyboard layout, which I used for a year. I measured my typing speed on qwerty before the change, and on the optimized keyboard after using it for a year. Yep, you do type faster. In my case, it was 10%. Honestly, it wasn't worth it. There are way too many disadvantages, not least of which is the fact that that only your computer has your weird k…
> There are way too many disadvantages, not least of which is the fact that that only your computer has your weird keyboard. Meh. I can type fine on both my weird layout and on a regular one (either Swedish or English layout). Your point about speed I agree with, but I'll say that the point of an alternative layout shouldn't be speed, it's about comfort.
I've been typing in both qwerty and colemak around the same speed (>=100 WPM) for almost a decade. I ultimately ended up deciding to use qwerty at work and colemak at home. At least for me the comfort difference between layouts is marginal.