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North Korean animation outsourcing for Amazon, HBO Max series

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Re: North Korean animation outsourcing for Amazon, HBO Max series

#261

Post by Waterluvian »

karaterobot wrote: post #35

The HN headline is more clickbaitey than the original article, which has a different headline and goes out if its way to point out that Amazon and HBO are likely not the ones doing the outsourcing to North Korea. > There is no evidence to suggest that the companies identified in the images had any knowledge that a part of their project had been subcontracted to North Korean animators. In fact, as the editing comments…

I wish that all people who exist in the business world would learn to appreciate that levels of indirection do not absolve anyone of wrongdoing. The law might give them a pass but that doesn’t make them innocent.

Re: North Korean animation outsourcing for Amazon, HBO Max series

#262

Post by wnevets »

karaterobot wrote: post #35

The HN headline is more clickbaitey than the original article, which has a different headline and goes out if its way to point out that Amazon and HBO are likely not the ones doing the outsourcing to North Korea. > There is no evidence to suggest that the companies identified in the images had any knowledge that a part of their project had been subcontracted to North Korean animators. In fact, as the editing comments…

> he HN headline is more clickbaitey than the original article, which has a different headline and goes out if its way to point out that Amazon and HBO are likely not the ones doing the outsourcing to North Korea

That is the beauty of the subcontractor shell game and one of the top reasons why companies do it, no one has to take responsibility.

Re: North Korean animation outsourcing for Amazon, HBO Max series

#263

Post by mitthrowaway2 »

x0x0 wrote: post #172
exhilaration wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But that's the most interesting part of the article - that Amazon and HBO projects are being worked on by NORTH KOREAN workers!!! I totally agree with the HN headline and I'm glad it got me to click and read the entire article.

It's also wild that it somehow makes financial sense to outsource a core input into your product. A company that makes animations outsourcing animation makes as much sense to me as a software company outsourcing engineering. Though we do have a plane company that outsources making planes, but that's going some sort of way right now...

I can see how one company might focus only on developing its technical skill in animation, rather than other aspects that are important to a production (like writing, music, marketing, etc), and do contract work for anyone who wants to make an animated production, no matter the story / market / etc. Sort of like how TSMC mostly focuses on semiconductor manufacturing excellence and leaves the design to other companies, with only a small amount of its production used to manufacture its own component designs.

But for studios where mastery of a certain animation style is critical to their work, vertical integration makes sense too.

Re: North Korean animation outsourcing for Amazon, HBO Max series

#264

Post by epiccoleman »

GordonS wrote: post #145
candiddevmike wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a little ironic considering part of season 2 has some meta commentary on how hard it is to create animated shows. Guess the easy way is to indirectly outsource it to NK!

And even more ironic given it was the story that made season 2 such a disappointing bore-fest - the animation was superb!

That season definitely was a little slow, but it left me wanting more, so I read through the comics. Based on the quality of what the show has done so far and of the source material I'm still excited for the next season whenever it finally comes

Re: North Korean animation outsourcing for Amazon, HBO Max series

#265

Post by Bayart »

iaaan wrote: post #134
constantcrying wrote: post #100

If you are outsourcing over the entire globe things like this tend to happen. There is very little you can actually do to verify how the work you require really gets done, especially if the format is purely digital and there is no physical process you could monitor. Companies building things in China have been caught in that trap multiple times and somewhere down the line the work was allegedly done by highly mistrea…

It's really easy though, actually, isn't it? Just don't toss problems over the fence to China. i.e. don't outsource things.

> i.e. don't outsource things.

i.e. don't be efficient. Outsourcing always gets a bad reputation, but holistically it's the best way for the greatest number.

Re: North Korean animation outsourcing for Amazon, HBO Max series

#266

Post by spamizbad »

x0x0 wrote: post #172
exhilaration wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But that's the most interesting part of the article - that Amazon and HBO projects are being worked on by NORTH KOREAN workers!!! I totally agree with the HN headline and I'm glad it got me to click and read the entire article.

It's also wild that it somehow makes financial sense to outsource a core input into your product. A company that makes animations outsourcing animation makes as much sense to me as a software company outsourcing engineering. Though we do have a plane company that outsources making planes, but that's going some sort of way right now...

From the prospective of these companies, the "core input" of the product is already in their hands: The intellectual property of the stories/characters. Media productions from this core IP is down the value chain.

Re: North Korean animation outsourcing for Amazon, HBO Max series

#267

Post by VS1999 »

s1artibartfast wrote: post #236
VS1999 wrote: post #225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think they were victims or deceived. It's normal for companies to set metrics that can't be legitimately achieved and then closing their eyes and pretending they don't know what's going on. A waste disposal company in Canada had a quota for "overflow fines", which ended with employees overfilling dumpsters themselves. Call centers set unachievable metrics that require employees to redirect and mark issues as…

If you are coming from the default position that companies inherently and always bad, I dont think we will be able to have a conversation about it.

I'd be willing to give some companies the benefit of the doubt, but not amazon of all things.

Re: North Korean animation outsourcing for Amazon, HBO Max series

#268

Post by Dalewyn »

x0x0 wrote: post #172
exhilaration wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But that's the most interesting part of the article - that Amazon and HBO projects are being worked on by NORTH KOREAN workers!!! I totally agree with the HN headline and I'm glad it got me to click and read the entire article.

It's also wild that it somehow makes financial sense to outsource a core input into your product. A company that makes animations outsourcing animation makes as much sense to me as a software company outsourcing engineering. Though we do have a plane company that outsources making planes, but that's going some sort of way right now...

Consider that Intel, Nvidia, AMD, Qualcomm, and Micron, all manufacturers of semiconductors, outsource their semiconductor manufacturing.

Consider that most game development studios outsource most development on a per-project basis.

Consider that most car manufacturers outsource most of their parts manufacturing to other manufacturers.

Basically: It's more unusual for a business to not be outsourcing their line of business.

Re: North Korean animation outsourcing for Amazon, HBO Max series

#269

Post by booleandilemma »

RajT88 wrote: post #79
beaeglebeachh wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honestly if N Korea had a cheap/low-barrier remote visa it might be attractive. I would imagine having an oppressive authoritarian regime looking at you as a prime tax slave might mean none of the prols would risk getting their head chopped off to mess with you. Meanwhile labor/rent/food gotta be hella cheap.

Let's game it out. You go there to work remotely. Food/labor/rest are super cheap. Everyone is starving to death there, to the point where meth is casually used by most people to stave off hunger pangs. Not to mention, if they decide they may just get some fun leverage out of a foreign hostage, they may just decide to claim you committed a crime and beat you half (or 3/4's) to death. This is just the news stories I c…

Do you really believe that everyone over there is starving?

Re: North Korean animation outsourcing for Amazon, HBO Max series

#270

Post by yourapostasy »

Waterluvian wrote: post #261
karaterobot wrote: post #35

The HN headline is more clickbaitey than the original article, which has a different headline and goes out if its way to point out that Amazon and HBO are likely not the ones doing the outsourcing to North Korea. > There is no evidence to suggest that the companies identified in the images had any knowledge that a part of their project had been subcontracted to North Korean animators. In fact, as the editing comments…

I wish that all people who exist in the business world would learn to appreciate that levels of indirection do not absolve anyone of wrongdoing. The law might give them a pass but that doesn’t make them innocent.

It will take awhile before regulatory requirements catch up and leverage technology that is already available today, but automated lineage capture of Relationship Bill Of Materials (RBOM) is already possible. We lack the data interchange standards and compliance compulsion to reify. That is in turn possibly due to regulatory and legislative capture? Other than the fleets of white shoe law firms that would be deployed against passage of such regulation, I do not know why structuring laws are in place for "trifling" $10K USD transfers, and not for these larger, more economically devastating cases of indirection.
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