'BYD said just last month that it has no plans to enter the U.S. auto market anytime soon'
No US automaker is thinking of anything like this or even losing a minute of sleep. Crank out some more 3 ton truck!
The $10k BYD Seagull EV is scaring the U.S. auto industry
71–80 of 119 posts
Re: The $10k BYD Seagull EV is scaring the U.S. auto industry
#72Earlier quoted context omitted.
This should be really difficult, especially since America and China have high tariffs in place for automobiles between each other as per China's WTO entrance agreement. But if you want to have a lot of fun, try importing (as a private citizen) any kind of car into China. It is virtually impossible, even if the car is old. My boss tried to get his Hummer into China once just for kicks, and the negotiations just went o…
As an infosec/cybersecurity practitioner, it is my jam to probe attack surface looking for weakness to exploit. This is simply another threat modeling exercise, policy instead of tech. I am not against the tariffs, but any means, there is value in protecting US domestic manufacturing for national security interests. But, there is a huge cheap EV TAM that is going unsatisfied by legacy auto and Tesla. I also have a lo…
Tesla had to move production to China originally because of import tariffs. The USA did not establish the bilateral tariffs to protect its car markets, these were in place to protect China's. It seems a bit unfair that the USA is getting flack for this two decades later.
Re: The $10k BYD Seagull EV is scaring the U.S. auto industry
#73Why can't low cost car have bigger body? If the whole car cost 10k, maybe they can enlarge the body with extra 2k.
Re: The $10k BYD Seagull EV is scaring the U.S. auto industry
#74Earlier quoted context omitted.
As an infosec/cybersecurity practitioner, it is my jam to probe attack surface looking for weakness to exploit. This is simply another threat modeling exercise, policy instead of tech. I am not against the tariffs, but any means, there is value in protecting US domestic manufacturing for national security interests. But, there is a huge cheap EV TAM that is going unsatisfied by legacy auto and Tesla. I also have a lo…
Tesla had to move production to China originally because of import tariffs. The USA did not establish the bilateral tariffs to protect its car markets, these were in place to protect China's. It seems a bit unfair that the USA is getting flack for this two decades later.
I admit I could totally fail, the learning is the exercise.
Re: The $10k BYD Seagull EV is scaring the U.S. auto industry
#75Everyone being like - we don't care about cars that small. It's the equivalent at looking at LLMs two years ago and being - it can't perform anything. It's an entry point and they will get bigger and better and more attractive - to the benefit of consumers upping the competition. Kia was written off when it first came to town. US domestics should be concerned - they wrote off Tesla as well.
In Germany in work-related traffic (commuting I guess) there are 1.1 persons per car in average. I guess it's similar in many other countries. So a small car like this would be perfect for most commuters. I always dream of a one/two-seat vehicle for that purpose, something alike the Renault Twizy.
Re: The $10k BYD Seagull EV is scaring the U.S. auto industry
#76Affordable small cars have never been a thing in the US, electric or not. There's zero reason to believe that this new batch will pose a threat.
The last age of the small car, which was pretty much the late 1970s in the US:
- oil embargo
- cars went downhill very quickly (planned obsolesence)
- inflation meant new car buyers could buy less.
Small cars died steadily under four decades of cheap gas, globalized production and financing keeping larger cars affordable (or at least, financable). Cars got a lot better, so used cars would work perfectly fine so you chose between a crappy small new car and a much better used one.
Now?
- used cars since COVID are still really expensive
- inflation again, and even before inflation, the 7-10 year car loan was becoming really common
- gas prices are a lot more volatile in the consumer perspective, and from a political long term standpoint carbon taxes may come into play soon in addition to reduced financing for new petroleum projects
- cash for clunkers will likely appear again in the next decade / recession as a way to usher off old ICE cars off the market
- increasing urbanization of the US combined with decreased tolerance for car traffic may result in SUVs being banned from cities, or an exhorbitant tax
- the war on the younger generations means along with increased global warming awareness means that an affordable small EV is likely much more "socially" acceptable, maybe even desirable.
- All US car companies are global, and the Chinese car companies are doing quite well in international markets. If China wins this market segment (especially in the Indian/Chinese market where there are 2.5 billion people) then that provides enormous scale to assault all other market segments. They are already climbing the model ladder in Europe.
The SUV/Pickup is still king of the US, but let's face it that was always a product of marketing. Marketing can falter quickly. The most popular vehicles aren't even SUVs, they are station wagons dressed up in marketese as "crossovers". That shift has already begun.
Re: The $10k BYD Seagull EV is scaring the U.S. auto industry
#77Why can't low cost car have bigger body? If the whole car cost 10k, maybe they can enlarge the body with extra 2k.
Bigger body = higher shipping cost because bigger and heavier, also they need a bigger battery or put up with less range for the extra weight, the heavier battery itself has weight so they need even more weight still to counteract that. So maybe they'd be able to add an inch or two for 2K, then what's the point of that?
Re: The $10k BYD Seagull EV is scaring the U.S. auto industry
#78Everyone being like - we don't care about cars that small. It's the equivalent at looking at LLMs two years ago and being - it can't perform anything. It's an entry point and they will get bigger and better and more attractive - to the benefit of consumers upping the competition. Kia was written off when it first came to town. US domestics should be concerned - they wrote off Tesla as well.
Saying Americans only want big cars is just as ignorant as saying Europeans only want small cars.
Re: The $10k BYD Seagull EV is scaring the U.S. auto industry
#79I hope so. The price of EVs in the US market is ludicrously overinflated. It's understandable for new startups like Rivian, Lucid and co, but in the case of existing auto manufacturers, early adopters are subsidizing the cost of redeveloping tooling that should have been easily covered by nearly a century of profit leeched away by shareholders. GM, Ford and Stellantis should have been able to produce a sub-$20k EV by…
Sub $20k is not realistic in 2024.
Even barebones ICE cars without AC and with everything cheap plastic start higher and return no margin. The last car that was widely available below $20,000 was the manual, no-ac Honda civic from the widely panned post-housing bubble model generation. Mitsubishi also sold a widely panned barebones model, their Mirage, that sold poorly.
Cheap cars with no margin is a suckers bet. The auto industry carries way too much debt and can’t deliver such a product and remain in business for long.
Re: The $10k BYD Seagull EV is scaring the U.S. auto industry
#80>The introduction of cheap Chinese autos — which are so inexpensive because they are backed with the power and funding of the Chinese government — to the American market could end up being an extinction-level event for the U.S. auto sector,” the organization writes.
This would never happen. The industry is too big to fail. It would get bailed out just like it did during the 2008 crisis.