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Paris preserves its mixed society by pouring billions into public housing

nytimes.com

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Re: Paris preserves its mixed society by pouring billions into public housing

#621

Post by robertlagrant »

underlipton wrote: post #346
robertlagrant wrote: post #334

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A lot of the decently-paying jobs in services, tech, etc. that these communities rely on essentially make the world a worse place, but they're profitable, and people gotta eat. If those jobs are paid for by voluntary customers, then that's fine. If they're subsidised through taxes of people who don't want them, that's the issue I'm mentioning.

>If those jobs are paid for by voluntary customers >If they're subsidised through taxes of people who don't want them Yes.

If they're subsidised, they're not paid for by voluntary customers.

Re: Paris preserves its mixed society by pouring billions into public housing

#622

Post by pjmlp »

Zamiel_Snawley wrote: post #528
twelve40 wrote: post #500

Earlier quoted context omitted.

they don't; it's just not practical. You have to be relatively fit and energetic to do it every day, have no chores like kids pickup, have extra time on your hands, the weather has to be perfect - no rain or god forbid snow. This only works for a particular segment of working people out there.

The Dutch beg to differ[0]. Over a third of Dutch people cycle as their most frequent mode of transport. Over a quarter of all trips are on a bike. 49% of primary school students and 75% of secondary school students cycle to school. Cycling has been a national priority for the Dutch, like the automobile has a been a priority for much of the rest of the developed world. With e-bikes, fitness and terrain are less relev…

Netherlands is on a sweet spot for cycling.

They don't have 40°C in Summer like in Southern Europe, or -20°C like in the Alps.

Re: Paris preserves its mixed society by pouring billions into public housing

#623

Post by gamblerrr »

twelve40 wrote: post #500
harimau777 wrote: post #462

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do people deal with being sweaty at work? Do offices generally have showers?

they don't; it's just not practical. You have to be relatively fit and energetic to do it every day, have no chores like kids pickup, have extra time on your hands, the weather has to be perfect - no rain or god forbid snow. This only works for a particular segment of working people out there.

Everything only works for a particular segment of people, but you exaggerate how small this particular segment is.

You don’t need to be fit, just not entirely out of shape — or ride an ebike. You can easily do chores, get groceries, etc. on a bike. I take my kid to school in a cargo bike regularly. It’s faster than driving (at rush hour at least) because there’s no stoplights on the bike path. And rain gear is a thing.

It’s not for everyone but haters always claim it’s for no one. No, it’s just not for you, stop being a hater.

Re: Paris preserves its mixed society by pouring billions into public housing

#624

Post by Spivak »

ericmcer wrote: post #189
jvanderbot wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> instinctively repugnant To some. In very-red areas that I have relatives, they're happy to do a food drive, make donations, help pay for weddings or funerals, or show up to help repair houses. When you have 100 cousins and 10 brothers, this is a viable option. They frequent each others businesses, work on interconnected industries, and in general help out however they can. It's not instinctively repugnant to help ,…

I think it is most repugnant when you are working really hard and (very slowly) building your life up. It was really easy to be charitable when I was young and working meaningless jobs for $15/hr and I had my whole life ahead, and it will probably be easy when I am retired and no longer feel the strain of 50/hr workweeks. For now though it is brutal watching taxes eat huge chunks of your income so they can spend flag…

I'm in the working stage and it's the most charitable I've ever been, I finally have adult money. I can throw down anywhere from $100-$1000 to help someone on the regular and not even notice.

What makes it so different for you where you have strictly more money than when you were young but have less money in excess? Folks in the comments saying being middle class is harder than being poor are insane to me, this is way better than when I was broke.

Re: Paris preserves its mixed society by pouring billions into public housing

#625

Post by charnould »

mebazaa wrote: post #34

As a Parisian, who is generally angry at the city’s housing policy (build taller!), I find the public housing of the past few years to be a great achievement. In general, public housing sits on the outer edges of Paris, but the city has been agressive in reconverting buildings in posher neighborhoods. It doesn’t really lead to reduced rent (because no additional supply), but it decreases social segregation. That alon…

I've made a 3D map of social housings in Paris/France: https://charnould.github.io/rpls-3d/ Territorial segregation is a thing.

Re: Paris preserves its mixed society by pouring billions into public housing

#626

Post by WarOnPrivacy »

greyman wrote: post #96
WarOnPrivacy wrote: post #5

"A city, if it’s only made up of poor people, is a disaster," said Mr. Apparu, who now works for a property developer. "And if it’s only made up of rich people, it’s not much better." From a human+social position, I strongly agree with this. The value of social benevolence isn't limited to the direct beneficiaries and has positive impacts beyond the economics.

But that literally never happens, each city contains both rich and poor people.

Strictly sure but the quote more addresses the experience that visitors, residents and prospective residents have.

Re: Paris preserves its mixed society by pouring billions into public housing

#627

Post by Spivak »

username332211 wrote: post #486
smeej wrote: post #434

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think this only looks true on a local level. It's easy to see why Jimmy pulls ahead of Johnny when Jimmy's working more diligently, but they're starting from a fairly even playing field. A lot of the big cards are just dealt to you. Your parents, your skin, your religion, your school, your intelligence, your health, the neighborhood you grow up in--these things have a huge impact on what you do or don't have to ove…

Is it me or are you going into the "You're no better than me. You are just lucky to have been taught good work ethic by your parents" territory?

These are the times I wish we had a life simulator because I think people would really start to understand just how many advantages they have and the ways they contribute.

It's like how everyone says they would be anti-slavery if they grew up before the civil war despite the numbers just not supporting that. If I took away your advantages and made you do your life over you probably aren't going to break the mold and will end up roughly where everyone else of similar life circumstance ends up. What special spark could you even have? Because hard working and smart people are born in all walks of life but that only takes you to a local maximum.

You start having to consider that maybe white people are actually the superior race if you truly believe that it's not privileges because how else do you explain the vastly uneven distribution of success in the US?

Re: Paris preserves its mixed society by pouring billions into public housing

#628

Post by vladvasiliu »

Fradow wrote: post #612
harimau777 wrote: post #462

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do people deal with being sweaty at work? Do offices generally have showers?

Offices generally don't have showers. People also generally don't arrive sweaty when biking (at least not more than those taking public transportation in the summer). To avoid being sweaty: go slower to not over-exert yourself, wear less clothing (you might be a bit cold when starting your commute, but that's not a big deal), and if it's still not enough (not fit enough, hills, etc...), an electric-assisted bike migh…

Also: don't wear a backpack if it's not one of those "air-something" that allow airflow on your back.

Re: Paris preserves its mixed society by pouring billions into public housing

#630

Post by nathan_compton »

rafaelero wrote: post #61
throwaway63467 wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn’t take much to destroy a city with money, I can see it happen in a few cities in Europe now. Foreign money, mostly from non EU countries like Russia keeps pouring in raising the market value until no local can afford renting or owning an apartment anymore. Look at places like Sylt or some nicer towns in Switzerland or France, they basically got overrun by rich a••holes buying everything they could. Boggles m…

Local families are the ones getting rich by having their houses surge in price. And they are probably also the reason why new houses are not being built.

Assuming they aren't renting.
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