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Paris preserves its mixed society by pouring billions into public housing

nytimes.com

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Re: Paris preserves its mixed society by pouring billions into public housing

#461

Post by itishappy »

mrguyorama wrote: post #307
fnord123 wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's false. People will not go into suspend mode when not walking; they still burn calories. A very large person would burn about 130 calories walking a mile. i.e. one large latte. And most people who are this large are not at risk of a caloric deficit by burning an extra 130 calories.

Humans are INSANELY efficient at walking. That's why walking and running are terrible ways to lose weight.

About 2x as efficient as a Model 3.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_efficiency_in_transport

Re: Paris preserves its mixed society by pouring billions into public housing

#462

Post by harimau777 »

mpweiher wrote: post #361
vladvasiliu wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I understand Paris to have undertaken a serious revolution in purging cars within the past decade. The issue is that they have mainly increased the friction of using cars in the city (reducing lanes, restricting parking, converting avenues to one-way) all the while the public transit enhancements are running late, and whatever lines were already there saw a drop in service quality. So increasing density would requi…

> [increase friction for cars...no improvement to public transport] Hmm...aren't you forgetting something? Last I checked, Paris had a veritable bicycling revolution. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cycling_in_Paris Le Plan vélo de Paris (2015-2020) doubled bicycle lanes to 1000km and increased ridership (apparently already high?) by 50% or more. The current plan is to add another 180km and make Paris 100% cyclable.

How do people deal with being sweaty at work? Do offices generally have showers?

Re: Paris preserves its mixed society by pouring billions into public housing

#463

Post by AnthonyMouse »

digging wrote: post #454
AnthonyMouse wrote: post #446

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> However, someone loudly driving a multi-ton car down your road is always "okay". Cars with fart pipes installed are the same kind of violation. Modern cars with functioning mufflers or electric powertrains... aren't actually that loud.

> Modern cars with functioning mufflers or electric powertrains... aren't actually that loud. Until their tires hit asphalt. Cars have to go very slowly for the engine to be louder than the tires, and that noise is a function of weight, and electric cars are heavier than equivalent ICE cars.

Most of the sound from a modern car with a functioning muffler is wind noise. You can barely hear the tires unless you're standing right next to it.

"Electric cars are heavier" is some silly nonsense where people went looking for something to complain about. You can make an electric car as light as you want, with the trade off that it implies making the battery smaller and reducing range. But the Model 3 has a ~300 mile range and weighs the same as the average car.

Re: Paris preserves its mixed society by pouring billions into public housing

#464

Post by the_gastropod »

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #411
the_gastropod wrote: post #393

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hear hear! Anytime someone argues something like "I could never give up my car and live in a city! They're so noisy!" I feel like a version of that Goose meme. "NOISY FROM WHAT?"

> "NOISY FROM WHAT?" Sirens, people yelling, loud music, construction, etc.

Credentials: Lived in NYC for 10+ years

Sirens: valid. But those suckers are usually attached to vehicles

People yelling: not often in my experience. And the usual offender when someone is yelling, it's some doofus in a car yelling at some other doofus in a car.

Loud music: not often in my experience. And the usual offender when there is loud music, it's some doofus playing loud music in their car.

Construction: valid

But the single most frequent / annoying loud sound: car horns. Constantly.

Re: Paris preserves its mixed society by pouring billions into public housing

#465

Post by bloppe »

everforward wrote: post #271
smeej wrote: post #169

> The program has allowed Mr. Chaillou and his wife to raise their two boys in the city. But he knows that the future of social housing will always face at least one big challenge: “The problem is that once you get in, you never want to leave.” I think this is the reason so many in the U.S. are skeptical of/resistant to such plans. Why work your butt off for 10 years to get to a place where you can afford a nice dwel…

People also don't like it because it in effect means the government is competing against you for property using your own money. I.e. if the government buys up 10% of the posh neighborhood to add cheap housing, the number of posh units goes down 10% and you paid for the taxes to make that happen. So you're paying taxes to give someone else the thing you want, and make it harder for you to get that thing in the future.…

Fairness is not the same thing as equality, and most people appreciate that.

Re: Paris preserves its mixed society by pouring billions into public housing

#466

Post by itishappy »

cm2187 wrote: post #421
barbazoo wrote: post #418

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> parisians will pay for this with high taxes for a very long time Is that a bad thing?

I guess not for the people who think they are entitled to the rest of the population subsidising their lifestyle.

So, everybody? It's a city. Last I checked Paris was not full of homesteads and organic farms.

Re: Paris preserves its mixed society by pouring billions into public housing

#467

Post by epolanski »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #440
epolanski wrote: post #382

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because as a society we progress at the pace our weakest progress. We don't say China moved ahead because the rich got richer, but because it lifted hundred of millions from poverty. And if anything, a poor social net tends to create more dangers, not less. When people have no roof, no jobs, no help, they will turn into criminals. Hell if I need to eat, or worse, I need to feed my family, I could not care less about…

>We don't say China moved ahead because the rich got richer, but because it lifted hundred of millions from poverty. I was under the impression the poor in China moved ahead due to working, not because the Chinese government subsidized their housing or other basics. Although, the Chinese government did subsidize their ability to find and get to work via huge infrastructure projects.

China has always had planned housing welfare, it was the only way of building houses for decades.

Liberalized housing started in the 90s along the rest, but planned housing projects have kept existing and had huge budgets till the late 2010s. Even today around one in twenty development housing projects is still state funded.

Anyway, I was mostly talking about them as a society lifting more and more of the weakest. And yes, building houses has been a major contributor of this obviously as well as a stimulus for the economy.

Re: Paris preserves its mixed society by pouring billions into public housing

#468

Post by bedobi »

GardenLetter27 wrote: post #373

Public housing is terrible - why should the government steal my money (income tax) to pay to house criminals and drug dealers nearby which devalues my property and endangers my life and family? We just need a true Free Market - let people build and invest how they want, where they want. And ensure that everyone has a stake in the property they own and the area they live in.

why should the government steal my money (income tax) to pay to subsidize you driving around in and parking your private automobile, for every trip, everywhere, including in dense urban environments?

Re: Paris preserves its mixed society by pouring billions into public housing

#469

Post by harimau777 »

ipaddr wrote: post #433
ketralnis wrote: post #379

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone who lives in an area with plenty of high-density residential buildings, I can attest that I love it and I wish there were more American cities that were an option for my lifestyle.

America is filled with high rises. Where are you from?

What do you mean? In my experience outside of the few major cities (New York, LA, etc.) there are only high rises in the very downtown of large cities.

Re: Paris preserves its mixed society by pouring billions into public housing

#470

Post by CalRobert »

rTX5CMRXIfFG wrote: post #106
mebazaa wrote: post #34

As a Parisian, who is generally angry at the city’s housing policy (build taller!), I find the public housing of the past few years to be a great achievement. In general, public housing sits on the outer edges of Paris, but the city has been agressive in reconverting buildings in posher neighborhoods. It doesn’t really lead to reduced rent (because no additional supply), but it decreases social segregation. That alon…

> build taller As someone who lives in an area with plenty of high-density residential buildings, I can attest that this is a perfect recipe for creating congested cities with such intense light and noise pollution.

What is making the noise?
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