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Vancouver’s new mega-development is big, ambitious and Indigenous

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Re: Vancouver’s new mega-development is big, ambitious and Indigenous

#101

Post by singingboyo »

inkcapmushroom wrote: post #88
faeriechangling wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You might think so but nimby’s hatred of tall buildings is not at all limited to the ones the Squamish nation is building, as evidenced by the lack of buildings this tall. It’d be more racist for them to make an exception to their usual moaning about tall buildings just because it was the Squamish doing the building.

>as evidenced by the lack of buildings this tall The third picture shows the development projected onto a wider picture of the city. You can see plenty of other skyscapers, some looking similar height or nearly as tall. Just not any on the side of the river the Squamish are planning on building. I do agree though that NIMBY's will generally whine regardless of the person doing the building. I wouldn't say "[all] the…

> You can see plenty of other skyscapers, some looking similar height or nearly as tall. Just not any on the side of the river the Squamish are planning on building.

That's kind of the entire point of Vancouver NIMBYism, at least around Kits/Point Grey. The "backyard" for them is basically "anywhere except the downtown peninsula" (the other side of the inlet in the picture).

They won't care too much if someone builds a 20-40 story building on the West End/peninsula. Do the same thing on the west side ([1], off the peninsula) and they'll throw an absolute fit.

[1] The West End neighbourhood and the colloquial west side are a solid 10-20 minutes apart from each other, driving time. Geographically - West End is on the peninsula, and the west side is basically the various neighbourhoods across the inlet (False Creek) from it.

Re: Vancouver’s new mega-development is big, ambitious and Indigenous

#102

Post by spxneo »

camg55 wrote: post #90

Think this is great for Vancouver which needs more housing. The zoning is broken, and far too conservative. Glad to see the Squamish addressing a need that will likely benefit all, and hopefully this encourages the city of Vancouver to do the same on their own accord.

Building more homes in Vancouver will not result in lower prices because this is not a supply problem it is the financial assetization of home equity that drives higher and higher prices. Blue collar workers turned multi-millionaires rely on the continued rise of home prices to purchase cheap credit which they use to speculate on more homes. When they couldn't find anymore locals they turned to the international market to sell their bags. Now these 20k homes ppl are celebrating are NOT going to be sold under market prices no matter how much reddit and hn crowd wants it to be true. It will only stabilize the prices at current inflated levels.

Be careful what you wish for. The only type of housing they are building is not white picket fenced backyard with a shed that is being converted to homes but high/low rise apartments primarily for rental, a hotbed for crime.

Since David Eby overrode the strata no-rental rules, while not responsible it resulted in huge increase in cases of squatters, petty theft, drug labs and brothels. This does not include what a retired VPD officer describes as an "Amazon of drug labs and brothels" which is familiar to vancouver high rise but now its even easier for criminals. Vice reporters were even reporting on it years ago but now these cases are accelerating since Eby stepped in a populist spirit.

I'm all for alleviating housing situation but we need to stop and ask if those people who are demanding/feel entitled to it really have the necessary income to justify it. Often I see people making 60k CAD/year lamenting how they can't find a home to live in. You can't afford anything in developed urban centres except in emerging economies.

So I think rather than building more housing we need to ask who really has merit to be here and the biggest determining factor is income not how long you lived in Vancouver like certain demographic of locals are suggesting which is basically dogwhistling to say the market forces should not apply to them because of their skin colour.

Simply blaming this on local housing policy failure like reddit does when housing prices has been appreciating all over the world, not just Vancouver, is myopic. There are cities that are far more dense than vancouver and has even more ridiculous real estate prices. They love Vancouver and the blue collar Canadian workers that bought their homes after 6 month of work in the 70s, 80s are not desperate to sell as they have nowhere else to go.

Lot of people are being setup for major disappointments if they think vancouver home prices are coming back down to 2012 prices. There is simply no way to force homeowners to sell when they have no urgency or financial stress to do so. over 50% of homeowners in Vancouver do not have mortgages.

Re: Vancouver’s new mega-development is big, ambitious and Indigenous

#103

Post by singingboyo »

mthoms wrote: post #87
Yizahi wrote: post #66

Moderately dense development - good High rise developments enclosed in glass - bad Plants on the skyscraper terraces - sheer stupidity and bullshit, used only for pretty marketing 3D art If they made those high rises a 5-6 floor buildings instead, with no b/s trees on the balconies but instead planted them in the ground, that would be much more boring, cheaper and much more comfortable to live there.

What's wrong with plants on the terraces and balconies? How would their presence make it less comfortable to live there? And high rise developments "enclosed in glass"? As the article mentions, that's sort of what Vancouver is known for. Is it the material you object to or the building height? I genuinely don't understand your comment. Particularly as a Vancouverite (who can't afford a home).

Also, as a Vancouverite... 5-6 stories, cheaper to live there, AND more comfortable? Dunno about that.

I've got doubts about cheaper, and 5-6 story buildings in Vancouver always seem less comfortable than a skyscraper (for whatever reason - maybe just that the 5-6 story buildings are mostly old?)

Re: Vancouver’s new mega-development is big, ambitious and Indigenous

#104

Post by notatoad »

guardiangod wrote: post #65

The native nation, Squamish Nation, used to own the entire parcel of land immediately north of the 10 acres land mentioned in this article as a reservation granted by the former-colonial government (a native village stood in Vancouver downtown but the colonial gov forced them to move across the inlet). But thru multiple forced relocations and unceded land take over, the reservation was gradually taken over. >Slowly,…

Thanks for the context, i did not realize that this was land that had been returned to the squamish nation. The previous reporting i'd seen on this developemnt made it sound like the parcel was the original treaty land.

Re: Vancouver’s new mega-development is big, ambitious and Indigenous

#105

Post by reso »

I say this all as a YIMBY who is very happy to see 20k new units added to vancouver: something feels off about the plans for the Jericho lands but I can't describe it.

I feel like when you have these mega developments where 10 condos go up all at once in the space of a few blocks, they end up as "bedroom neighborhoods", where people sleep but don't do anything else. There are a lot of these happening in Canada right now. There's one on Victoria in Waterloo. Concord place in Toronto is another example. I don't see street life there. I only see people going to or coming from somewhere else.

The best neighborhoods are the ones where there is a broad-strokes master plan, but beneath that, some amount of decentralization in implementation. Then you get a diversity of ideas about how to live all in one place.

Maybe there are words for this I don't know.

Re: Vancouver’s new mega-development is big, ambitious and Indigenous

#106

Post by spxneo »

api wrote: post #48

Let me see if I got this. 1. Settlers colonize indigenous lands, drive indigenous people into small parcels and reservations and try to exterminate their culture. 2. Settlers decide to start refusing to build enough housing for themselves because they don’t want to alter the “character of the neighborhood” after… uhh… very much doing that. 3. Indigenous people build housing on their remaining bits of land for settler…

Canadian indigenous settlements have been described by some as an "open air prison".

Re: Vancouver’s new mega-development is big, ambitious and Indigenous

#107

Post by [deleted] »

spxneo wrote: post #102
camg55 wrote: post #90

Think this is great for Vancouver which needs more housing. The zoning is broken, and far too conservative. Glad to see the Squamish addressing a need that will likely benefit all, and hopefully this encourages the city of Vancouver to do the same on their own accord.

Building more homes in Vancouver will not result in lower prices because this is not a supply problem it is the financial assetization of home equity that drives higher and higher prices. Blue collar workers turned multi-millionaires rely on the continued rise of home prices to purchase cheap credit which they use to speculate on more homes. When they couldn't find anymore locals they turned to the international mark…

[deleted]

Re: Vancouver’s new mega-development is big, ambitious and Indigenous

#108

Post by Seattle3503 »

systemstops wrote: post #95
fckgw wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What does acceptable use of their own land look like to you? What would meet your specific approval?

It's acceptable to me - none of my business. But it's corporate money building this project, which we should be clear about. It's just built on native land.

I'm not sure why that matters? If others would offer the tribe a better offer, I'm sure they would accept it.

Re: Vancouver’s new mega-development is big, ambitious and Indigenous

#109

Post by wnc3141 »

reso wrote: post #105

I say this all as a YIMBY who is very happy to see 20k new units added to vancouver: something feels off about the plans for the Jericho lands but I can't describe it. I feel like when you have these mega developments where 10 condos go up all at once in the space of a few blocks, they end up as "bedroom neighborhoods", where people sleep but don't do anything else. There are a lot of these happening in Canada right…

If it is discontinuous with the broader urban fabric this is definitely a risk.

Look up Ørestad in Copenhagen - a massive master planned area that never gained any of the hoped for vitality you would see elsewhere in the city.

A decent video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8OMxzXsufq8

Re: Vancouver’s new mega-development is big, ambitious and Indigenous

#110

Post by curmudgeon22 »

lwansbrough wrote: post #8
Erikun wrote: post #7

It’s a pretty interesting development. I wonder what the legal framework for someone living there will be if they’re not a First Nation citizen? From the article: “ But Indigenous nations are accountable, first and foremost, to their own citizens. That could mean temporarily barring access to traditional lands, as in Joffre Lakes. It could also mean maximizing the economic potential of their property, to provide hous…

In terms of land/home ownership, what it has meant in other parts of the metro area, is leaseholds. You can “buy” a property at a slightly reduced cost which will be reclaimed after several decades (100 years?), usually starting from the time of development. In terms of laws, policing is handled by the local police force, ie. VPD. While there is rhetoric about sovereignty, practically speaking much of the challenging…

These leaseholds are typically more difficult to get a mortgage on, restricting lenders and increasing price :/
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