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Self-control signals and affords power

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Re: Self-control signals and affords power

#81

Post by c4wrd »

nebula8804 wrote: post #30
smallmancontrov wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> less prone to get "bullied" by other managers into doing work for them and you can stand up more for your team This is the real key. Management is about controlling others and not letting others control you without compensation. > I would personally trust others who have self-control more than those who don't for time-sensitive and critical tasks because I can rely on them to regulate their emotions and give honest…

>I was heavily indoctrinated in the language of self-control, responsibility, and accountability, and these made me easy to exploit. My own "red pill" moment involved understanding these as tools of power rather than facts of the world, thereby freeing myself to better represent my own interests. Can you give some clearer examples? I am curious how this is done in those circles.

Having self-control can give a false sense of self-righteousness, and if you're not careful, this will lead to you eventually caring about how you look and you will do whatever it takes to maintain the image of self-control/responsibility. If you carefully analyze this, you are now basing your self-worth on external appearances, therefore you are giving your control away to anyone who can see this projection. Anyone experienced with controlling others can sniff out this projection and then use it against you in this way: "We need to think about the importance of handling this (X) responsibly. What do you think we should do?". Now they are telling you they think you can make responsible decisions on an important decision, stroking your projected ego, and they've activated your want to act responsibly to do something for them.

Now, it doesn't always mean that this is a way someone is manipulating you. Self-control is realizing that this ego-stroke feeling of making you feel important does not mean to need to involve yourself or act. You need to separate the emotion from the decision-making process and realize that others can use your emotions to manipulate you. It's up to you to decide whether you can trust this person or not, you just need to be aware that the emotion could have been intentional or unintentional.

Re: Self-control signals and affords power

#82

Post by idiotsecant »

jack_pp wrote: post #73
pilgrim0 wrote: post #37

IMO simply striving to gain power or money is easier than to achieve greatness and mastery, in general. Mainly because one can lie their way into power and money, countless examples of that both at a local level and global level. Now, mastery requires the opposite of lying and pursuing easy to achieve goals. It’s the hardest path because frustration is constant, and it requires one to keep stretching the limits of th…

> IMO simply striving to gain power or money is easier than to achieve greatness and mastery While my ego would want to agree the truth is staying in power and making money exponentially isn't easy either, and you can't lie your way to lifelong power and fuck you money because eventually people figure you out, your reputation plummets and then you have less power and less opportunity to make money. That said you choo…

I think luck and lying is essentially the method to real wealth. Find me someone who got there without those two elements. Wealth is an expression of your ability to manipulate other people into devoting their labor to your enrichment. You don't get there without some deception.

Re: Self-control signals and affords power

#83

Post by Rediscover »

coop_solution wrote: post #15
c4wrd wrote: post #10

This is something I've noticed in myself and I'm glad there's research to back this, although this is an open secret to those who do master self-control. I've spent the last three to four years working on self-control and discipline after I hit rock bottom in my life and realized I had no self-agency. For me, having greater self-control led me to ensure I can focus on providing value where it matters in my life, and…

Is there any way to disagree with this comment without being disregarded as resentful? Good work is the key to good fortune / Winners take that praise / Losers seldom take that blame

Good quote from Neil Peart. Roll the bones

Re: Self-control signals and affords power

#84

Post by sunshinerag »

idiotsecant wrote: post #82
jack_pp wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> IMO simply striving to gain power or money is easier than to achieve greatness and mastery While my ego would want to agree the truth is staying in power and making money exponentially isn't easy either, and you can't lie your way to lifelong power and fuck you money because eventually people figure you out, your reputation plummets and then you have less power and less opportunity to make money. That said you choo…

I think luck and lying is essentially the method to real wealth. Find me someone who got there without those two elements. Wealth is an expression of your ability to manipulate other people into devoting their labor to your enrichment. You don't get there without some deception.

i.e like your worldview. good to know

Re: Self-control signals and affords power

#85

Post by __turbobrew__ »

ozim wrote: post #57
glitchc wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not to mention luck.

If you try against all failures and are persistent and you finally get lucky. Versus giving up after first or second failure. Is it still luck that is most important?

Depending on your background the luck variable will be different and you may have to try more or less times to get a successful outcome.

Re: Self-control signals and affords power

#88

Post by tekla »

CharlesW wrote: post #50
boringuser2 wrote: post #39

A controversial take from this is that, aside from the health benefits, you will also accrue personal and professional benefits from not being fat. I remember interviewing when I was chubbier post-COVID thinking that the only evidence the interviewer has of my self-control and drive is that I have none. Best case scenario, you are interviewing a temporarily embarrassed skinny person. Noble prize winner James Watson,…

> …you will also accrue personal and professional benefits from not being fat. As an overweight person, I don't think it's controversial. You'll also accrue personal and professional benefits from being a tall man and/or good-looking. However, "fat people have no self-control" is still fatphobia and ignores the interplay of genetic, metabolic, physiological, cultural, socio-economic, and environmental factors that co…

As a former obese person, the culture of America is excusing people for being fat is disgusting. I'm not saying you have to be supermodel thin, but being fat is literally bad in every single possible metric (Except for possibly surviving longer in a survival situation, which I presume most fat people will never be in)

Being fat is bad. Being a normal weight is better in every metric

Re: Self-control signals and affords power

#89

Post by dasil003 »

jack_pp wrote: post #73
pilgrim0 wrote: post #37

IMO simply striving to gain power or money is easier than to achieve greatness and mastery, in general. Mainly because one can lie their way into power and money, countless examples of that both at a local level and global level. Now, mastery requires the opposite of lying and pursuing easy to achieve goals. It’s the hardest path because frustration is constant, and it requires one to keep stretching the limits of th…

> IMO simply striving to gain power or money is easier than to achieve greatness and mastery While my ego would want to agree the truth is staying in power and making money exponentially isn't easy either, and you can't lie your way to lifelong power and fuck you money because eventually people figure you out, your reputation plummets and then you have less power and less opportunity to make money. That said you choo…

Both great points. One way to think about it is that pursuit of wealth simply has more competition—the opportunities for the upper tiers are very few relative to the population that aspires to them. It is objectively hard to get there regardless of whether you lie or not. One thing is certainly true though, you can't get there without incredible social leverage of some sort, otherwise why would tens or hundreds of thousands multiples of per capita GDP be routed to you?

The answer is: you kind of have to bring something uniquely valuable to the table. Exceptional skill with people and general intelligence are certainly valuable ingredients, but to really crack the upper tier some kind of domain mastery is what really pushes you over the top. Bonus points if it's a new domain, fast to monetize and scale, hence the rapid rise of tech in the Fortune 500 over the past couple decades through the web and smart phone revolutions.

Re: Self-control signals and affords power

#90

Post by glitchc »

ozim wrote: post #57
glitchc wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not to mention luck.

If you try against all failures and are persistent and you finally get lucky. Versus giving up after first or second failure. Is it still luck that is most important?

Luck is a huge factor in your starting point. It's significantly harder to become a millionaire if your starting point is a group home in a poor country. An unlimited amount of persistence can't overcome those odds.
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