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European crash tester says carmakers must bring back physical controls

arstechnica.com

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Re: European crash tester says carmakers must bring back physical controls

#271

Post by knorker »

userbinator wrote: post #168
branko_d wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Then again, it also boggles my mind how car makers in the US continue to use flashing red lights as the turn signal instead of yellow lights. Technology Connections channel had a video about that a while back: https://youtu.be/O1lZ9n2bxWA?si=xKRgMFK1DFBrB3i0

Flashing red = car is pointed away from you Flashing yellow = car is pointed towards you It's the same reason why headlights are white and taillights are not (unless reversing, in which case the tail becomes the head temporarily, and thus white reversing lights.)

That's what tail lights are for.

Re: European crash tester says carmakers must bring back physical controls

#272

Post by letitbeirie »

threeseed wrote: post #33
userbinator wrote: post #16

But the organization wants to see physical controls for turn signals, hazard lights, windshield wipers, the horn Are there really cars where the horn is not a physical button/ring on the steering wheel? IMHO the driving UX peaked in the 1960s, and was largely unchanged into the 2000s, until touch screens started taking over. Compare: https://i0.wp.com/www.curbsideclassic.com/wp-content/uploads... https://images-stag.…

I think the issue with the horn is referring to the Tesla Model S. And specifically the horn button being capacitive co-located with the voice assistance and windscreen wiper buttons. Which in a safety situation was difficult to locate and press.

It's weird that Tesla is being called out over the horn.

In driver's ed they tell you to not to use your horn when you're annoyed at other drivers - only use it if there's an imminent danger to avoid a crash.

But you better hope it works because if it doesn't, the airbag behind it explodes.

...

I'm not sure Tesla improved the situation, but it definitely seems like the situation has room for improvement.

Re: European crash tester says carmakers must bring back physical controls

#276

Post by generic92034 »

modeless wrote: post #238
iforgotpassword wrote: post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But even then, how do you find the A/C or volume control on a touch screen without taking your eyes off the road, without accidentally touching something else? You just can't feel your way to the volume knob. Sure, you are a responsible driver and would only do that at a traffic light or other completely safe situation, but I don't know how many accidents touch controls in cars already caused with less responsible dr…

Volume is on the steering wheel. A/C is automatic and I don't need to touch it the vast majority of the time. While driving the most I might want to do is adjust the temperature, and since it's not safety critical I can choose a convenient time. It's at the bottom of the screen so it is easy to do by grabbing behind the bezel and only requires a quick glance to align your thumb. In practice I glance at physical A/C c…

> While driving the most I might want to do is adjust the temperature, and since it's not safety critical I can choose a convenient time.

That is good reasoning, but are you sure a high number of drivers are also waiting with adjustments, instead of fumbling on the screen while continuing to drive?

Re: European crash tester says carmakers must bring back physical controls

#277

Post by jojobas »

gsich wrote: post #259
jojobas wrote: post #248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tesla Cybertruck uses steer-by-wire with almost no redundancy. Electric power steering was bad enough to cause crashes, this is just ambulance chaser's dream.

>steer-by-wire This is the norm for most cars with servo steering.

No. Almost all cars except some concepts and prototypes have mechanical link between the steering wheel and the steering rack. Even if the link is augmented by a hydraulic or electronic booster.

If a booster fails you have a chance of overpowering it, it's not that strong. A faulty steer-by-wire will swing you into the oncoming lane with no recourse.

Re: European crash tester says carmakers must bring back physical controls

#278

Post by franga2000 »

modeless wrote: post #238
iforgotpassword wrote: post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But even then, how do you find the A/C or volume control on a touch screen without taking your eyes off the road, without accidentally touching something else? You just can't feel your way to the volume knob. Sure, you are a responsible driver and would only do that at a traffic light or other completely safe situation, but I don't know how many accidents touch controls in cars already caused with less responsible dr…

Volume is on the steering wheel. A/C is automatic and I don't need to touch it the vast majority of the time. While driving the most I might want to do is adjust the temperature, and since it's not safety critical I can choose a convenient time. It's at the bottom of the screen so it is easy to do by grabbing behind the bezel and only requires a quick glance to align your thumb. In practice I glance at physical A/C c…

It seems like you have a more sensible car than many. I was recently in one with really dumb automatic AC that needed adjustment very often, the AC settings were in a menu behing two clicks, there was no convenient landmark to orient my hand without looking, the temperature slider was very small and dense needing high precision and the temperature text was rather small. And the steering wheel buttons are, of course, not remappable.

I drive about a dozen different modern electric cars on a regular basis (carsharing) and all of them have at least a few of the above flaws (if not for AC then for something else that needs adjusting while driving).

Re: European crash tester says carmakers must bring back physical controls

#279

Post by Dunati »

modeless wrote: post #247
sundvor wrote: post #237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tesla wiper? Just push the wiper button on the left stalk and you can cycle through the speed settings with the left funky switch (multi function button) in addition to the on screen display options that then pop up. Very easy to do. Also this: https://youtube.com/shorts/3eKcDOHVZWc?si=-jL4o4Bhu-2y0ibj Doesn't cover the left multi function button feature after short pressing the wiper button. (Model 3, 2022, Australi…

> Just push the wiper button on the left stalk and you can cycle through the speed settings with the left funky switch Yes, they added this relatively recently. For the first few years I owned the car this was not possible. Also, guess what, it still sucks! More steps than a physical control, fiddly because of the short timeout, and still requires an extra step of looking at the touchscreen because you can't know whi…

I have a 2018 model x with a traditional wiper dial stalk and it almost never works. It has markings for 5 settings and most of the time it just ignores the setting you have it on. The auto setting doesn't seem to change the behaviour at all. My model 3 was annoying with the wipers on the touchscreen (mostly) but at least they worked consistently.

Re: European crash tester says carmakers must bring back physical controls

#280

Post by forgetfreeman »

stby wrote: post #268
oven9342 wrote: post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People have already died because of the screens “The ship's user interface [touch screen] was found to have contributed to the sailors' confusion.” https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_John_S._McCain_and_Alnic_M...

Seems to be a US Navy thing ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_Air_Flight_655#Potential_... ). On a more serious note, there's a big difference between a vehicle like a car that is operated by one person, and a ship with a large crew with dedicated tasks.

True. With a car there are fewer eyes monitoring the situation and frequently little or no time to correct from a mistake.
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