Did anyone actually ever put web apps on their home screen?
have a 'link' to fast.com on my homescreen, but it's just a shortcut to an url, no 'web app' or am i mistaken?
It’s Official, Apple Kills Web Apps in the EU
41–50 of 329 posts
Re: It’s Official, Apple Kills Web Apps in the EU
#42The creation of the Vision Pro, and now this direct assault on the open web, makes me believe that Apple is no longer has the vision to lead the industry effectively. It's a shame because it has enormous momentum behind it, which means every bad decision, like this one, will be felt be millions of people for years.
Apple is a 3 trillion business that is out of growth drivers. They will need to squeeze more money out of everybody in the ecosystem to appease wall street. Or launch a new 500bn product line but I don’t think they have anything big in the pipeline.
The problem is that a large percentage of that pie is just rent seeking from App Store fees. The App Store should be opt in for all parties.
I think the analysis in this thread is correct, Apple wants to remove the “loophole” that was originally the only way to get apps on the device.
Re: It’s Official, Apple Kills Web Apps in the EU
#43Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think it's a bit of a stretch to call a web app "develop[ed] for iOS" The whole point of the web is that it is cross platform. That isn't a negative thing it's a positive, but calling it "develop for iOS" is arguably disingenuous.
Most people just want to make apps for themselves. If you use an iOS device but not a Mac, there was no way to do that before web apps (which still offered a terrible dev experience, without debugging) and now there's again no way to do it.
You could actually debug by connecting to a Mac running safari via USB. Not that it matters anymore.
Re: It’s Official, Apple Kills Web Apps in the EU
#44Any chance we can get the original title which doesn't sound so childish: It’s Official, Apple Kills Web Apps in the EU And if PWA were such a threat to Apple's business then why are they allowed in US.
IIRC In the EU apple may be forced to open up iOS to other browsers, including PWA using non-safari engines. Not sure why this is such a threat. I’m torn on this whole issue. I both enjoy my walled garden and want full-fat Firefox on iOS.
well you can use Firefox as it is
you trust Mozilla and (the real) Firefox on iOS will not implement anything that is insecure
right now, Mozilla will not be able to implement plenty of web standards even if it was secure according to Mozilla browser engineers
no question with time, Apple will be forced to allow modern web capabilities in Firefox too and also make the iOS welcoming for modern web browsers like Firefox just like literally every other OS is welcoming, including macOS
it will be a debate around whether these OS changes Apple supposedly has to make are a reasonable effort for Apple to make... being that big and and having macOS already capable, iOS will be just as secure for Firefox as every other OS
however, you can trust Mozilla engineers that they will not expose Firefox browsers to security problems on iOS even when it is sub-optimal, so in some weeks just check out what Firefox on iOS already can and use it
Re: It’s Official, Apple Kills Web Apps in the EU
#45Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's unfortunate that the whole discourse is about one of the worst imaginable outcomes: replacing apps with shitty slow bloated underperforming web apps. That is, the discourse is valid, and Apple is to blame. But why did it have to be around PWAs of all things?
do I just hear the arguments again how java is slow vs c++? the browser is the jvm of a web app, very secure and js engines like V8 is extremely capable... although js programs can be run at near native speed (the browser is a c++ program normally and there is native compilation of some code fragments) you should also make yourself familiar with webassembly tech... some folks use even node.js on the server side... th…
> do I just hear the arguments again how java is slow vs c++?
No, no you don't
> the browser is the jvm of a web app, very secure and js engines like V8 is extremely capable
And what this has to do with apps and the fact that web apps are universally slow, bloated, underperforming, and require significantly more resources to do the most primitive things than native apps?
> you should also make yourself familiar with webassembly tech
Same question as above
> some folks use even node.js on the server side...
Some folks use even java server side... this surely means we have an abundance of amazing great apps written in Java?
> the js UI model is also very good
There's literally no UI model in Javascript.
> there will be a great competition and in those areas where native has competitive edge, it will win
There will be no competition because lazy people and people who have never seen the world outside their web bubble will simply opt for the cheapest option.
Re: It’s Official, Apple Kills Web Apps in the EU
#46This is criminal. After decades I finally had the ability to develop for iOS without a Mac and a yearly $99 fee - only for it to be crippled again?
> I finally had the ability to develop for iOS without a Mac Cordova, React Native, Xamarin, Flutter etc. Seems like the only thing criminal here is your inability to use Google.
They all still require the yearly $99 fee. Not to mention the need to learn another platform. I already know the web.
Re: It’s Official, Apple Kills Web Apps in the EU
#47> It’s telling that this is the feature that Apple refused to share. And it makes sense: the idea that users could install safe and secure apps that Apple can’t tax, block or control is terrifying to them. I think that’s what this decision is all about. When Safari was the only browser engine on iOS, PWAs didn’t threaten the App Store because Safari delivers a degraded experience with them. With alternative browser e…
This is quite often where people make the greatest mistake. It's all about distribution and customer usage. Most people hate and don't use PWAs.
What stands in the way are Native iPhone apps are better. It also goes for android too. That's why PWAs fail. If they were successful Apple would find a way to monetise the hell out of them.
Re: It’s Official, Apple Kills Web Apps in the EU
#48I'm not a fan of web "apps" for the usual reasons: resource hungry, limited functionality, low quality overall.
However, I want DaisyDisk for iOS. When will Apple allow DaisyDisk for iOS? :)
Re: It’s Official, Apple Kills Web Apps in the EU
#49Did anyone actually ever put web apps on their home screen?
web apps are the future, not the present
Apple was holding them back and just pulled the plug. Only if web programmers can count on future proof support will they produce web apps.
In addition, most companies have already created native apps so again, web apps are the future, it is not an argument that there are few on iOS
and yes, outlook or X are good examples
Re: It’s Official, Apple Kills Web Apps in the EU
#50Any chance we can get the original title which doesn't sound so childish: It’s Official, Apple Kills Web Apps in the EU And if PWA were such a threat to Apple's business then why are they allowed in US.
One example: a while ago I worked on a bluetooth le based companion app for industrial sensors. The client would absolutely have built this as a web app if iOS had offered web bluetooth. With alternative engines this would be possible and Apple does not want these kind of applications outside the App Store. With the right engine basically any kind of app could be created as a webapp / pwa So in the US it doesn’t matt…
> One example: a while ago I worked on a bluetooth le based companion app for industrial sensors. The client would absolutely have built this as a web app if iOS had offered web bluetooth. With alternative engines
Do you know that the only "alternative egnine" that implements hardware APIs is Chrome? Because it's a Chrome-only non-standard that Firefox opposes, too?