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Raising Children on the Eve of AI

juliawise.net

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Re: Raising Children on the Eve of AI

#61

Post by Voultapher »

Biologist123 wrote: post #43

The writer says: “[My children] are more viscerally worried about climate change”. I’m not surprised. I recently heard from a friend that her 7 year-old child had, as a class assignment, to create a timeline setting out the impact of climate change over their lifetime. I was gobsmacked, and feel this amounts to a form of psychological child abuse. It’s a serious problem, don’t get me wrong, but having a small child l…

I wonder if in a cruel way that's what our biosphere needs. Democracy plus capitalism has proven itself, by virtue of incentives and systems, fundamentally incapable of addressing the topic. "Vote for me, I'm going to make your quality of life worse!", is not a short-term winning strategy in our current world. Maybe we need a generation of angry and depressed children, that grow into adults and are willing to break the proverbial wheel.

That said, I'm not condoning cruelty. All I know is, that if we continue as we were, we will be destroying the world for our grandchildren and a myriad of species [1]. Personally I believe that realistically the question "will our decisions kill billions in terrible ways" is not valid anymore. Rather the question has become "how many billions".

[1] https://dothemath.ucsd.edu/2022/09/death-by-hockey-sticks/

Re: Raising Children on the Eve of AI

#62

Post by alumic »

bbor wrote: post #31
alumic wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I drove around today listening to the most recent Lex Fridman podcast, in which the founder of Boston Dynamics was describing replacing human labor with machines that were capable of learning by seeing. I have family in the trades. I pursued tech and fell in love with the field. Listening to the interviewee, I began to feel sick to my stomach at the glib description of what amounts to ripping away peoples' livelihood…

Work is equivalent to worth. We are not biologically or sociologically prepared to differentiate the two. I’m gonna say there’s a very very selective “we” in use here. I’m sure you’re accurately reporting your surroundings, but many people outside America (and a few within it!) are very much already there. Plus, like, isn’t that kinda depressing? What are disabled people “worth”? If I choose to be an unpopular niche…

It is depressing. I think that this might just be the whole picture. Look, I spent a long while studying evolutionary biology in school (detour into pre-med) and came away with a fairly bleak picture of our place in the universe. I use "worth" in precisely that context. Nature gives us a world in which "he who does not work, does not eat" is a rule of law.

Human beings--especially modern ones--assign worth quite differently, and I think that you and I would agree that morally, the way we refer to "worth" in our modern context is the correct framing. But you cannot deny your own biology, no matter how much the modern world insists that you can. You are evaluated according to nature's standards of "worth," (the worth that it imposes onto our psyche) and then secondarily, according to our own set of invented standards. So yes, it is deeply sad. No one will care about the out-of-work tradesperson.

I promise I'm not a luddite. Just stopping for a moment to smell the roses.

Re: Raising Children on the Eve of AI

#63

Post by keiferski »

ildjarn wrote: post #55
keiferski wrote: post #13

I think kids are a lot more prepared for this future than professional technologists probably realize. If you ask them today what profession they want to be, you often get “YouTuber” as an answer. Which might seem like a joke, but I think it’s actually quite accurate in terms of future professions. The jobs at most risk from AI are “anonymous” ones in which the creator of the work is unknown to its consumer. Writing,…

You don’t think AI generated content creators are a threat?

Only in situations where the creator is anonymous or has a weak brand now. For creators that are functionally celebrities (I.e., successful YouTubers) people follow them because they like the human behind the video. I don’t see AI replacing that, potentially ever.

Re: Raising Children on the Eve of AI

#64

Post by xbmcuser »

keiferski wrote: post #37
alumic wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I drove around today listening to the most recent Lex Fridman podcast, in which the founder of Boston Dynamics was describing replacing human labor with machines that were capable of learning by seeing. I have family in the trades. I pursued tech and fell in love with the field. Listening to the interviewee, I began to feel sick to my stomach at the glib description of what amounts to ripping away peoples' livelihood…

For autonomous robots to replace the millions of tradesmen and workers, it would require vastly more resources than are being put toward this now. I wouldn’t expect human labor to be replaced in this way for a century or two.

It is not happening in the next decade but the change will come a lot faster than a century. As the tech needed for it is improving rapidly as well as getting cheaper. And I think many people are thinking in all or nothing scenario but long before everything is completely autonomous they will bring in efficiency where 1 person with autonomous helpers will be completing jobs that needed multiple people before.

Re: Raising Children on the Eve of AI

#65

Post by seabird »

inference-lord wrote: post #12

I became a parent about a year ago, completely unprepared for this future. My Son was born around the time ChatGPT-4 was released and I remember all the Geoffrey Hinton interviews which were really apocalyptic sounding, he is has a kind of kookie mad scientist vibe about him too. I remember thinking, like what the fuck just happened? Like I just woke up in a movie. I've learned to accept the situation, and realize th…

Not to minimize your concerns, but as it stands, AI is replacing dick-all in the near term. Wondering what employment will exist in 3 years is a tad silly. This shit is confidently wrong without a tinge of doubt and the mitigation for that is babysitting to the point where nothing but the most trivial jobs can be entrusted to it. I wouldn't sweat it robbing you of your career when it can't even recite airline ticket policy properly.

Re: Raising Children on the Eve of AI

#66

Post by tayo42 »

RobinL wrote: post #32
bbor wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems like our careers could just be snuffed out instantly with little recourse available. You’ve likely heard this sentiment before but it’s the right one so I’ll be the one to post it today: your job is not your purpose, and the economy is not the society. Obviously your whole comment is well founded and relatable, but I think this is the only cure for your anxieties. The world is a beautiful, beautiful place, w…

I think this is subjective. I get a sense of purpose from my job. I don't feel like 'just' a labourer, I feel like by working I'm contributing to society and helping others. I don't want infinite leisure, I want to feel useful. A good day's work is very satisfying. But at the point machines can do my job better than I can, it might be difficult to feel useful.

What happens to your purpose when you get fired, laid off, company goes out of business?

I would be really surprised if there was anything more then a fringe minority that found a sense of purpose from their job.

Re: Raising Children on the Eve of AI

#67

Post by keiferski »

j4yav wrote: post #50
keiferski wrote: post #13

I think kids are a lot more prepared for this future than professional technologists probably realize. If you ask them today what profession they want to be, you often get “YouTuber” as an answer. Which might seem like a joke, but I think it’s actually quite accurate in terms of future professions. The jobs at most risk from AI are “anonymous” ones in which the creator of the work is unknown to its consumer. Writing,…

Why would the vast majority of people watch a human YouTuber or other kind of charisma-based influencer when they can choose from infinite custom generated ones that always provide exactly the content they want at any time, look and act just like they want them to, and listen to feedback perfectly, and interact with them on a one on one basis?

For the same reason people line up to get popular fashionable products that look the same as everyone else, when they could have an infinitely customized one for far less.

The “customization” narrative is far too based on assumptions of individualism, and doesn’t factor in sociability at all.

Re: Raising Children on the Eve of AI

#68

Post by dbish »

keiferski wrote: post #63
ildjarn wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don’t think AI generated content creators are a threat?

Only in situations where the creator is anonymous or has a weak brand now. For creators that are functionally celebrities (I.e., successful YouTubers) people follow them because they like the human behind the video. I don’t see AI replacing that, potentially ever.

There are quite succesful vtubers fwiw, pretty easy to make those with AI in the near future.

Re: Raising Children on the Eve of AI

#69

Post by keiferski »

xbmcuser wrote: post #64
keiferski wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For autonomous robots to replace the millions of tradesmen and workers, it would require vastly more resources than are being put toward this now. I wouldn’t expect human labor to be replaced in this way for a century or two.

It is not happening in the next decade but the change will come a lot faster than a century. As the tech needed for it is improving rapidly as well as getting cheaper. And I think many people are thinking in all or nothing scenario but long before everything is completely autonomous they will bring in efficiency where 1 person with autonomous helpers will be completing jobs that needed multiple people before.

That will still take decades, if not a century. Manufacturing and developing millions of robots that walk around and do repairs (not to mention making them economically affordable) is not something that’s going to happen soon. What’s more likely is that robots replace human factory workers first.

Re: Raising Children on the Eve of AI

#70

Post by threedark »

What happened to all the people who were saying AI is just a stochastic parrot and aren't worried at all about AI?

Is it that this thread only attracts people who are worried about AI or is there an actual paradigm shift that all the nay-sayers are realizing they were wrong?

Serious question, don't take it the wrong way if you were a nay-sayer. No offence at all.

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