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Alexei Navalny has died

reuters.com

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Re: Alexei Navalny has died

#821

Post by tomComb »

hackinthebochs wrote: post #770
wolverine876 wrote: post #740

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you believe the western media, the west no longer believes in or upholds its values, and watches while Russia pushes westward while China builds up a military and eyes Taiwan, both more than happy to destabilize the middle east in pursuit of their goals. > The west needs to wake up, we're slowly sliding towards a world conflict. This is going to get worse before it gets better. I think there's an essential conne…

>No more time for games. It's time, as you say, to wake up and stand up for our values. This makes a nice tweet. But what does it actually mean in practice?

For starters, support the Ukraine.

Re: Alexei Navalny has died

#822

Post by freedomben »

ethanbond wrote: post #655
stcroixx wrote: post #474

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Europe deciding to depend on Russia for their energy and not focusing on defense spending is the unbelievable part to me, but they've been doing this for quite some time now. They walked right into it. Russia is doing what they've always done and always will do.

The strategy of economic integration as a way to reduce military tension has worked very well in many other instances. It doesn't seem like an obviously insane thing to have tried.

Indeed. There's a common saying that sort of derives from Frédéric Bastiat that "where goods cross borders, armies don't." Trade and economic dependence is the best deterrent of war that there is. That doesn't necessarily mean that it stops all war, but it definitely raises the cost of war and costs matter.

It's also IMHO the most productive and ethical way to reduce/prevent war. Maybe they shouldn't have allowed something so fundamental as energy to become a dependence, but generally speaking the principles are sound.

Re: Alexei Navalny has died

#823

Post by meitham »

avmich wrote: post #624

I'm trying to compare Alexei with some other known political figures. For Americans, I think Alexei is roughly comparable to MLK. USA was able to gradually turn from some positions to different others. For Russia it seems the current situation is still the fall to the deeper chasms of self-destruction.

Are you serious? He’s more comparable to Trump or KKK leadership!

Re: Alexei Navalny has died

#825

Post by wolverine876 »

holoduke wrote: post #788
wolverine876 wrote: post #740

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you believe the western media, the west no longer believes in or upholds its values, and watches while Russia pushes westward while China builds up a military and eyes Taiwan, both more than happy to destabilize the middle east in pursuit of their goals. > The west needs to wake up, we're slowly sliding towards a world conflict. This is going to get worse before it gets better. I think there's an essential conne…

Ah come on. The west is as hypocrite as any other country. Look at what they did in too many places in the world. Human rights my pents. The phone you are holding is probably created by some child hands. If there is one thing what the west could improve is this silly Disney like black and white thinking. There must be a good and a bad. Its nonsense. Bad a good goes hand in hand.

> The west is as hypocrite

Everyone and every institution is a hypocrite. If that's going to stop us, we might as well have submitted to the Nazis or Bolsheviks or someone long before that - after all, we were hypocrites then too!

But who am I to say that - I'm a hypocrite. No hypocrites allowed on HN!

Re: Alexei Navalny has died

#826

Post by wolverine876 »

saiya-jin wrote: post #804
wolverine876 wrote: post #733

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Generally you avoid conflict by being scary, not agreeable. As a rule of life, that's a pretty bad idea. I don't avoid conflict with family, friends, neighbors, coworkers by being scary. In international relations, it's by far more effective to be agreeable. Alliances are far more stable than competitive balance between 'scary' countries. Look at the EU; look at Korea - which relationships are more stable, the scar…

Your argument falls apart since you deal with mobsters who don't respect any contract if it doesn't suit them. Remember pinky promises that they won't invade Ukraine just before they did it? If you keep stepping back to bullies, soon you are standing with ocean behind your back. And if you don't think russians would love ruling as much Europe as they can grab, you haven't been listening to them a single bit for past…

You confuse 'agreeable' - admittedly an ambiguous term - with 'walkover'. You can negotiate both with strength and without being a monster yourself.

Re: Alexei Navalny has died

#827

Post by wolverine876 »

nec4b wrote: post #812
wolverine876 wrote: post #733

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Generally you avoid conflict by being scary, not agreeable. As a rule of life, that's a pretty bad idea. I don't avoid conflict with family, friends, neighbors, coworkers by being scary. In international relations, it's by far more effective to be agreeable. Alliances are far more stable than competitive balance between 'scary' countries. Look at the EU; look at Korea - which relationships are more stable, the scar…

>> As a rule of life, that's a pretty bad idea. I don't avoid conflict with family, friends, neighbors, coworkers by being scary. Are they trying to conquer and kill you? If not, your analogy doesn't hold.

I'm talking generally, not about Russia. Even then, being 'scary' in particular only escalates things; you want to be strong yet perfectly in control.

Re: Alexei Navalny has died

#828

Post by kjellsbells »

tivert wrote: post #763
ncr100 wrote: post #732

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure that's an accurate reflection of the man's views. Your sequencing is not construable to a new fact. He did recant any notion of Ukrainians being Russian. He also asserted ukrainians Right to independent self-governing.

> I'm not sure that's an accurate reflection of the man's views. Your sequencing is not construable to a new fact. > He did recant any notion of Ukrainians being Russian. He also asserted ukrainians Right to independent self-governing. I never followed Navalny very closely, but my understanding was he opposed Putin but he was also a Russian nationalist , so (at least pre-2022) there wasn't tons of distance between th…

s/liberals//g

Has happened over and over again that the Western political class prioritizes alignment with some entity on some short term goal over checking that the entity shares any other sentiments. And then being all surprised-pikachu when they dont.

US funding mujahideen against the Soviets.

Israel funding Hamas to keep the PA weak.

Europe lauding Aung Sang Suu Kyi in Myanmar

etc.

Any time you see a puff piece in mainstream Western media about some leader abroad that "we find we can work with" or has similar cheese, beware.

Re: Alexei Navalny has died

#829

Post by Gibbon1 »

myth_drannon wrote: post #659
logicchains wrote: post #643

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By rules of law you mean international law? By that logic we should also commit preemptive strikes against Israel to prevent it committing what is recognised by the internal community as genocide.

[flagged]

[flagged]

Re: Alexei Navalny has died

#830

Post by tryauuum »

1970-01-01 wrote: post #456
aerique wrote: post #385

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I never understood why he went back to Russia.

I have held the exact same question. I don't say this lightly. His decision was stupid. He would've been much more effective as a critic with a Twitter account. You can't criticize the government when you're not free to do so.

why would russians care about what some twitter boy happily living in EU has to say?
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