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Asahi Linux project's OpenGL support on Apple Silicon officially surpasses Apple

arstechnica.com

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Re: Asahi Linux project's OpenGL support on Apple Silicon officially surpasses Apple

#161

Post by delta_p_delta_x »

mavamaarten wrote: post #102
Sunspark wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If using Gnome, only use integer scaling. 100%, 200%, 400%. KDE will have working fractional scaling for the DE and apps using QT and there you can adjust a slider to a % you like.

See but that's exactly the thing, on Mac you can just pick a scaling and every scaling option looks flawless across the board. Integer scaling is silly for me: it's either huge or tiny. Yes, KDE does it better and with Wayland you can also do fractional scaling. But the original point stands: it sucks on (most) linux and works flawlessly on Mac.

> See but that's exactly the thing, on Mac you can just pick a scaling and every scaling option looks flawless across the board.

Not really, if you have a discerning eye.

Any non-integer resolution on macOS is rendered at twice that resolution, and then raster-scaled down and anti-aliased. So, if you have MacBook with a 2560×1400 display and you select any other resolution besides that and 1280×800 (exactly half), the desktop render will be raster scaled.

To be fair, it works better than Wayland's previous behaviour because of the 2× rendering factor, but you can absolutely still see scaling artifacts if you look for them, and I certainly do. Ringing around text in a dark-mode editor is especially obvious.

The only OS that has gotten HiDPI right is Windows.

Re: Asahi Linux project's OpenGL support on Apple Silicon officially surpasses Apple

#162

Post by rowanG077 »

selectodude wrote: post #76
wkat4242 wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They shouldn't have deprecated OpenGL though. It's really important for desktop software. Several games have lost Mac support due to this like elite dangerous. Of course they push metal but that's not interesting to desktop developers.

OpenGL itself has been depreciated for almost 7 years now. I won’t wade into Vulkan vs Metal but depreciating OpenGL seems pretty reasonable to me.

Deprecating opengl is reasonable if they would have supported vulkan. Metal is just going backwards.

Re: Asahi Linux project's OpenGL support on Apple Silicon officially surpasses Apple

#163

Post by rowanG077 »

dylan604 wrote: post #58

Just the thought of how to prioritize things in all of the reversing is enough to make me overwhelmed. Have they talked about how they prioritize? "Asahi's most recent update blog post, published in mid-January, highlighted HDMI support, support for DRM-protected websites via Google's proprietary Widevine package, Touchbar support for the handful of Apple Silicon Macs that use one, and more." Seems odd to me that a L…

It's also a part of effort. USB is very hard taking months and months. Widevine is easy in contrast. So it's also a resource payoff tradeoff.

Re: Asahi Linux project's OpenGL support on Apple Silicon officially surpasses Apple

#164

Post by michaelcampbell »

wtallis wrote: post #112
michaelcampbell wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm reminded of a saying... The reasonable man expects to change to fit in the world. The unreasonable man expects the world to change around him. Thus, all progress is made by unreasonable men. (Paraphrased) > Being mad at software for operating in a different paradigm than you are used to is not productive. Indeed, it is often the ONLY thing that causes progress.

The "unreasonable men" who come up with better solutions are usually the people who have the deepest understanding of what is wrong with the status quo. I don't think the people who refuse to understand the problem are usually coming up with good solutions.

Understanding is a totally orthogonal concern. Just because someone doesn't like "The Apple Way(tm)" doesn't mean they don't understand it. Believing so just gives the "Apple's a cult" type people more ammo.

What most people on this thread are asking for is to be given the ability to mold/configure things that most other non-Apple apps provide. It's a well known trope to have the Apple culture say "You are wrong, do it this other way instead" rather than "here's how you get what you want".

Re: Asahi Linux project's OpenGL support on Apple Silicon officially surpasses Apple

#165

Post by RobotToaster »

hn8305823 wrote: post #49
HideousKojima wrote: post #33

[flagged]

Why do we care? Ashai Linux is obviously a high-IQ effort and we are very fortunate they are motivated to work on this instead of something else (like ML)

People mostly care that he wants to censor anyone mentioning it.

Streisand effect basically.

Re: Asahi Linux project's OpenGL support on Apple Silicon officially surpasses Apple

#166

Post by saagarjha »

chippiewill wrote: post #70
dylan604 wrote: post #58

Just the thought of how to prioritize things in all of the reversing is enough to make me overwhelmed. Have they talked about how they prioritize? "Asahi's most recent update blog post, published in mid-January, highlighted HDMI support, support for DRM-protected websites via Google's proprietary Widevine package, Touchbar support for the handful of Apple Silicon Macs that use one, and more." Seems odd to me that a L…

The Asahi team isn't some monolithic corporation with a prioritised backlog. The skillsets and amount of work involved in getting Widevine working (quickly porting the binary from ARM64 ChromeOS) vs USB 3 (reverse engineer Apple's unique undocumented implementation and write a Linux kernel driver for it) are completely different. It's open source, if someone volunteers a Widevine implementation for Asahi then the mai…

> The skillsets and amount of work involved in getting Widevine working (quickly porting the binary from ARM64 ChromeOS) vs USB 3 (reverse engineer Apple's unique undocumented implementation and write a Linux kernel driver for it) are completely different.

They're not all that different to be honest

Re: Asahi Linux project's OpenGL support on Apple Silicon officially surpasses Apple

#167

Post by larrik »

benn0 wrote: post #131
Scubabear68 wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems a lot of those gripes are about specific apps, or simply not understanding that MacOS does somethings differently. By contrast I have never been able to use Linux successfully as a desktop OS because there is a dearth of polished commercial apps, and the HW compatibility has always been iffy. MacOS generally works out of the box with the HW, and the apps are generally highly polished. I caveat the apps as “g…

This x100. I have regularly tried to set up a Linux environment, thinking that there really isn't that much of a barrier to being productive on Linux, but with the lack of polished commercial apps and the hardware quirks I always seem to spend more time finding workarounds than actually working. I have found more recently that I can get something reasonable (for me) set up, although I'm confident I'll always need a M…

> the lack of polished commercial apps

I didn't really run into this as an issue at all. Then again, "commercial apps" sounds largely like a relic of the 90's. It has Slack and Teams and Spotify and can run most games thanks to Valve.

Biggest thing I ran into was that MS Word is too buggy to 100% reliably read anything created in alternate programs. I know it's Word and not LibreOffice or anything because it happens between different versions of Word too.

Re: Asahi Linux project's OpenGL support on Apple Silicon officially surpasses Apple

#168

Post by RedComet »

throw10920 wrote: post #157
RedComet wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if you restrict his work to technology, it might be a wash at best. Wasn't he one of those leading the charge in getting Cloudflare to drop a site due to bullying allegations? I think I'd rather have Cloudflare be neutral than have a few Linux drivers for new MacBooks a couple of years sooner than otherwise.

> Wasn't he one of those leading the charge in getting Cloudflare to drop a site due to bullying allegations? Yikes, is this true? That would be wild - do you have sources?

I didn't follow the saga as closely as I should have, perhaps, given the gravity. But this* didn't take long to find, only shortly preceding the issue.

* https://twitter.com/marcan42/status/1409176583433179137

Re: Asahi Linux project's OpenGL support on Apple Silicon officially surpasses Apple

#169

Post by sunshowers »

breather wrote: post #158
sunshowers wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On balance, I really like that Ctrl is overloaded in that way. Means that Super/Win/Cmd can be used for a wide variety of things on top. For example, I use Super for tiling window management, launching programs, and other things. On macOS, with Yabai and skhd, you can't use plain Cmd to do that. Overloading Ctrl has downsides, but I think it is a net benefit overall.

I mean yea, but in practice I run into frustration that the terminal doesn't have a key dedicated to commands far more than I need to do something globally. Anyway, you can use cmd, you just need to have an actual command (non-modifier-key) to pass it—I have no use for a key that does one thing.

The problem is that many apps on macOS use Cmd + one or more other modifiers for their own shortcuts. On Linux at least, no apps that I know of use Super in any shortcuts.

Re: Asahi Linux project's OpenGL support on Apple Silicon officially surpasses Apple

#170

Post by overstay8930 »

Juicyy wrote: post #123
overstay8930 wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple does not want to be a hardware company, in fact when they sell lots of hardware their stock price goes down. If they can't charge a monthly fee for it, they're not doing it.

Only 20-25% of Apple's revenue is services. about 50% is iPhone about 8% for Mac and 8% for iPad. They're a hardware company.

I didn’t say they’re not a hardware company, I said they don’t want to be one because it makes shareholders very uneasy about the stability of the company.
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