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Nvidia is now more valuable than Amazon and Google

forbes.com

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Re: Nvidia is now more valuable than Amazon and Google

#291

Post by lm28469 »

xyst wrote: post #280

With the recent story of openai pitching VCs for a collective $5-7 trillion dollars and a GPU manufacturer becoming more “valuable” than diverse companies such as Amazon or Google. I am thinking this market is due for a massive correction. It’s not sustainable and built on the “promise” or con it will continue to skyrocket YoY. Just like the cryptocurrency/digital currency craze. This one (artificial intelligence) wi…

It's literally the same story over and over again, buy the hype, buy the futur hypothetical profits, disregard everything else including logic. Pure greed

Enron called it HFV, hypothetical future value

Re: Nvidia is now more valuable than Amazon and Google

#292

Post by pbmonster »

dralley wrote: post #136
wbsun wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am always wondering why ASML hasn’t got any antitrust lawsuits for their monopoly.

Because they're not a monopoly based on anticompetitive practices, they're a monopoly because what they do is so difficult and massively expensive that the monopoly is the only thing that makes it economically viable. The worldwide market for these machines is only perhaps a few dozen a year at most, it just can't support paying the R&D bills of multiple competitors. ASML is also part-owned by their customers. Intel,…

Also, it's only really a monopoly at the top end, and only right now. It's not like ASML is the only company building litho machines. Canon and Nikon still sell a lot of machines, they just decided not invest to much into competing at the top end over the last 10 years.

This could, theoretically, change at any moment, and Canon is trying something with their new generation of nano-print tech.

Re: Nvidia is now more valuable than Amazon and Google

#293

Post by alecco »

nostrebored wrote: post #41

When you look at the moat for these companies, is it really justified? I just think about ARM and Intel/AMD. I find it hard to believe that existing GPUs with their memory bandwidth considerations are optimal architecture and that in 20y we will have the same compute model But the last time I did any work with cuda was a decade ago, so very rough ideas here

They are way ahead and gaining speed: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39355625

And also the integration. The Nvidia datacenter clusters are ready as soon as you turn them on, unlike every other vendor until now requiring very difficult fine tuning for months.

Re: Nvidia is now more valuable than Amazon and Google

#294

Post by sufficer »

latchkey wrote: post #262
beachy wrote: post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Insufficient disclosure. You must be aware that of the companies you listed, one (yours) sticks out as being unknown. Don't die on this hill, just do the decent thing and add a disclosure. This doesn't show you in a good light.

[flagged]

Man you are wild.

Re: Nvidia is now more valuable than Amazon and Google

#295

Post by testless »

jsnell wrote: post #288
testless wrote: post #282

Lofty valuation with a PE ratio of over 90 - even considering the growth and margins. Also almost no revenue growth in 2022/23 according to quickfs.net. Too expensive for my taste.

You're being misled by the site. Those aren't really their 2023 results, but their FY2023 results. And Nvidia's fiscal years are just nuts, basically FY2023 is 2022. Their 2023 results will be reported as FY2024, and aren't out yet. But just the first three quarters showed 50% more revenue than the entire FY2023.

You are right, I was wrong. I have compared financial years, not actual years. There seems to be strong improvements with respect to revenue (66% TTM increase) and earnings per share (334% increase TTM).

Re: Nvidia is now more valuable than Amazon and Google

#296

Post by sangnoir »

beachy wrote: post #269
latchkey wrote: post #262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

I did not intend to be confrontational and you are correct that talking up your company without declaring your affiliation is not against HN guidelines. I feel it is however a convention that is widely followed and for good reasons. Obviously your call at the end of the day.

TBF, they weren't "talking up" their company, they simply added the name to a list of companies doing something that's going against the grain.

To quote Bill Burr roasting Apple, there's a bit of "Einstein - Gandhi - Me" going on, but its way below the threshold for identifying themselves as a founder, IMO.

Re: Nvidia is now more valuable than Amazon and Google

#297

Post by blitzar »

eastbound wrote: post #233
acchow wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Big tech and AI startups would buy all the 4090's in existence if they had NVLink. You would not be able to find one for gaming without a multiple x markup

So we’re deeply hampering our AI startups, limiting their growth and possibilities by jacking up the prices x10, to reserve some silicium only for gamers which could perfectly be used for AI? Maybe gamers can wait and the next technological leap should have priority?

Won't somebody think of the crypto miners.

Re: Nvidia is now more valuable than Amazon and Google

#298

Post by zozbot234 »

HWR_14 wrote: post #85
behnamoh wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the LLM world, each month is a year and each week is a month. AMD hasn't done anything substantive in the past two years since GPT-3/GPT-3.5. Almost every research paper implements their algorithm in CUDA. AMD can't beat software with good hardware.

Didn't AMD just commit to a CUDA compatible api? Did I hallucinate that?

Different kinds of compatibility. HIP is source compatible and officially supported. Zluda is the newly released project for running CUDA-compiled binaries.

Re: Nvidia is now more valuable than Amazon and Google

#299

Post by panick21_ »

fauigerzigerk wrote: post #254
mtsr wrote: post #234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Society isn’t shaped just by current laws, but also by where we want things to go. If the current situations is undesirable, changing laws and regulations is the way to change it. (Of course actually enforcing current laws and regulations can also go a long way in many cases…)

So what changes to the law do you propose? None of the little annoyances that Nvidia is occasionally creating amount to anything that could have resulted in their current dominance in AI processing. They made a good product. The competition is responding too slowly. And they got lucky with this crazy (in a good way) AI boom. I don't see how this could possibly be outlawed or why you would even want to. It will resolv…

How about right-to-repair. How about forcing better access, documented, attributable firmware. Open Drivers for Linux.

The government as a big costumers could demand these things, even without having a low. The military should demand these things to be open for various reasons.

I think Nvida can still make plenty of money in such a world.

In cases where an interface has absurdly high value for society if its a standard, the government could also 'buy' that and open it up. Just like they do with other infrastructure.

One could make the argument that the x86 interface should be public domain as it amounts to infrastructure that most of society builds on. How such a thing would exactly work is of course up for some debate. But the concept of the government 'liberating' common interfaces makes sense from a society perspective.

Re: Nvidia is now more valuable than Amazon and Google

#300

Post by Moldoteck »

smsm42 wrote: post #279

Could somebody explain to me what is the moat that prevents somebody else from taking on Nvidia? OK, they make GPUs. Why somebody else can't make GPUs? AMD took on Intel, Google took on Microsoft and Apple - is GPU market somehow harder to enter? I mean, we're talking piles of money from the looks of it - Amazon and Google do a ton of stuff, and NVidia only does (roughly speaking) one thing - and that thing is not ev…

nvidia is unique because of cuda and all ml software written/optimized for it. AMD can add cuda support too (and they started working in this direction) but they'll not be able to out-compete nvidia, with this strategy the'll stay at 2'nd place (by buying amd cards for inference you are by default less competitive as business doing ML compared to those that can buy nvidia) and will just strengthen nvidia's cuda moat. Imo it's less about money and more about a ton software that was optimized for nvidia cards and software that was built on top of that optimized software, it can't be easily ported to run as efficient on AMD, it's tons of code and it's unlikely devs would just port it + port all the new stuff that is researched at exponential scale.
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