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Apple Vision Pro review

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Re: Apple Vision Pro review

#261

I think we are now at a stage where VR hardware has surpassed software. Between this and the Quest 3, we have powerful, polished and consumer friendly devices, but beyond a few niches (fitness, simulation, gaming to some extent), there is nothing to convince users to put the headsets on. I am hoping we will see a lot of experimentation in the coming years, and I am excited for what the Apple ecosystem will bring to t…

I'm not sure I've ever liked the term "killer app", because I don't think it's particularly useful in describing real user thinking and behaviour. There was a very long journey from VisiCalc and Wordstar to the modern-day ubiquity of office computing. Different user groups have complex, diverse and overlapping sets of needs and wants that can rarely be distilled into a single application. I'm more inclined to think in terms of Bezos's one-way doors - changes in user behaviour that are sufficiently compelling to be largely irreversible.

I agree that progress has been slow in the consumer space and meaningful long-term adoption of VR has been confined to a few niches; that isn't necessarily an indictment of the long-term prospects for VR, because desktop computers spent much longer in that stage than most people remember.

In enterprise, I think things are more advanced and some user groups have decisively gone through the one-way door for some applications. I think the best example is architecture. If you've done a couple of client presentations in VR, you just aren't going back to showing renders on a flat screen, because immersing the client in a physical space is that powerful. It's not just a sales tool, but a communications tool - clients can understand and respond to the environment intuitively and give much better feedback as a result.

Industrial and clinical training is less clearly one-way, but I think we're very close in a lot of areas. AR is still less developed than VR, but I do think we're on the cusp of something significant - a sufficiently comfortable standalone AR headset with sufficiently high-quality passthrough can deliver training experiences that can't practically be replicated through other means.

I think one of the most interesting areas of development is in psychiatry. It's still early days, but we're starting to see real, meaningful benefits in RCTs for VR-based therapy of disorders like phobia and PTSD. Some of the most compelling results have been in the very sickest patients - people with psychosis, who often find it impossible to engage with conventional psychotherapy.

https://www.psy.ox.ac.uk/research/oxford-cognitive-approache...

I don't think it's remotely likely that VR will ever replace flat screens, but I do think that VR is slowly growing into a niche but durable HCI platform. Tablets are a reasonable analogy - a lot of people see them as a failure, but they still sell in serious volume and they're often a much better form-factor for specific applications than either a phone or a laptop, especially in industry. Tablets didn't change the world, but nor are they likely to go away.

Re: Apple Vision Pro review

#262

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Watching sports in 3D with spatial audio. > According to an exclusive report from The New York Post, NBA Commissioner Adam Silver “said the league is working with Apple to bring a tech-enhanced viewing experience” to its upcoming headset. When asked about it, he told the outlet: “We’re working very closely with Apple.” https://www.tomsguide.com/news/nba-games-could-be-apple-visi... If there is one group that has a tr…

With standard coverage of sports, they cut between cameras and zoom in/out, pan to follow the action etc. Even people attending the game will be watching big screens showing this content some of the time. I'm wondering how that translates to VR.. do they just teleport you around the arena? That seems like it would be a bit jarring if not altogether sickening.

It could offer a couple options. One being the main view is like you are there. You see the court in a huge view in your main view. Then, similar, but way better than in person, you have several big views off to the side, for replays, stats, maybe following a view of your favorite player... I would think they we have a way to make it so your view (switches as the action on the court switches to the other basket). That will have to be a good design but just the idea of something like teleporting from your seat with a great view of this half of the court to now having it on the other half.

And for other sports even better I think. With say soccer/football and football (USA) you can have a big overview (like you are sitting at midfield) but then camera angles for closer view of the action...

I think sports viewing could really be incredible. Figuring out exactly how to do it well will take awhile. But it seems to me the kind of thing Apple could do very well.

Re: Apple Vision Pro review

#263
post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm aware. I've worked in the space. It isn't as simple as you're making it out.

Sorry but almost 10 years ago I could do this on Xorg where the worst problem is that compositors cannot redirect input (so you had to kludge new events from scratch). I cannot imagine it would take more than _half an hour_ for someone with macOS display compositor experience to implement it.

And the reason Xorg is now dying in favor of a system that doesn’t have this capability is because the architecture that enabled it, while cool at the time, severely limited the graphics performance and capability of the applications.

Re: Apple Vision Pro review

#264

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Apple’s solution is that your corporate should buy you a second watch.

On the upside, once somebody figures out how to use smartwatches for VR haptic feedback, nerds will have a reason to wear six watches.

Four limbs, two nipples. Math checks out.

Re: Apple Vision Pro review

#265

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a bunch of VR games/apps that are notable for fitness. Beat Saber is the most well known one that's explicitly a game, Supernatural is maybe the most famous one that's framed as more of a fitness app/service. But other notable ones include Synth Riders, FitXR, OhShape, Pistol Whip, Thrill of the Fight, and (maybe) Gorilla Tag. And this list is far from exhaustive. VR is pretty good for fitness just because it…

I’d be too worried about sweat damage to use it for serious exercise.

They're built around that.

Re: Apple Vision Pro review

#266
post #73

The thing I don't get about spacial computing is: why? I feel like being able to see everything open at once would be incredibly distracting. I like how I can swipe between app screens on my desktop so that I'm only focusing on one app at a time. Of course I imagine there are some applications where it's useful, but to me it just feels like the Apple Vision Pro is just a very large screen and they haven't quite figur…

> I like how I can swipe between app screens on my desktop so that I'm only focusing on one app at a time.

You can shove the app into a corner of your room, out of your view, and it will be there when you walk over to that corner later. That's part of the idea of "spatial computing" - if we can associate computer objects with real locations in space, maybe we can better harness spatial memory and stuff like that when we interact with them.

Re: Apple Vision Pro review

#267
post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm aware. I've worked in the space. It isn't as simple as you're making it out.

Yes, it is. In fact, there's already a project for it on GitHub. https://github.com/saagarjha/Ensemble 480 lines total, including comments, headers, whole shebang.

Tech demos are often easy to put together.

It's all of the edge cases and UX refinements that takes time.

Re: Apple Vision Pro review

#268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That will never happen. Nobody will make real software for iOS because nobody wants to pay a 30% fee for the privilege of randomly having their whole business shut down when an app reviewer is in a bad mood.

What world do you live in? The iOS App Store is probably the most full fledged and populated app ecosystem there is.

And yet none of the software GP mentioned are available on it.

Re: Apple Vision Pro review

#269
post #219

I really like Joanna Stern, and how she approaches reviews like this. I’ve watched her review, The Verge’s, and MKBHD’s unboxing video. However, the best review I’ve found that actually transmits what is possible and what it is like to use is Brian Tong’s 55 minute review video: https://youtu.be/GkPw6ScHyb4 I’m not familiar with him, but unlike other reviews I’ve seen, he spends less time evaluating or summarizing, a…

Good review. Most interesting part was at 43:00 discussing the ergonomics and weight, which is the real question for everyone hoping to make this a daily driver. He said he could wear it 45 mins before needing to take it off, that it was overstimulating so you need to slow down how quickly you use apps and move things on screen, and that gestures also were fatiguing. You could tell he was trying to be fair but positi…

I've regularly done 2+ hours of light activity (e.g. mini golf, social hangouts) with my Quest 3 without issues, though I will note this is with a third-party head strap specifically designed to be way more ergonomic and comfortable than anything first-party from Meta or Apple [1].

[1]: https://www.bobovr.com/products/bobovr-m3-pro

A lot of the physical downsides here are basically self-inflicted by companies trying really hard to hide the "nerd factor" necessary for comfort, to the detriment of the actual user experience.

Re: Apple Vision Pro review

#270
I find it interesting that they include the archive.ph link on the front page.

Also, it's hard not to enjoy any review that includes the word "bejeezus."

The thing I most want to know about this device that went totally unmentioned is:

how sharp is the text? Or, how many windows of code can I comfortably see at once and is it more or less than my 30-something-inch monitor?

TBH, that's what will sway me one way or the other on this... my current monitor might have been $3500 nearly 20 years ago. It was $1000+ when I bought it in 2012. If this (or one of its near term successors) could replace it in a way that is better, I'm kind of interested.

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