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Anime is a $25B industry that pays its animators pennies

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Re: Anime is a $25B industry that pays its animators pennies

#201
post #9

While the industry as a whole makes a lot, the majority of individual anime and manga make next to nothing. It’s a few very popular properties that make all the dough. If people were paid fairly, most productions would be untenable. There would be just a few anime per year instead of many. But also, how would the popular ones come to be? Every new property would be a huge gamble. As an anime and manga fan, I actually…

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Re: Anime is a $25B industry that pays its animators pennies

#202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Western animators aren't paid that terribly, just anime animators, and only some of them. But part of the compromise that Western animation does to be more productive is that it all looks bad. There's a fake-anime style Superman cartoon on I saw that has the artistic quality of maybe a Japanese elementary schooler. And then Netflix makes animated sex comedies that look like old Flash cartoons.

I'm sorry, all western animation looks bad? Such sweeping generalizations, and so wrong. Exhibit A. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Secret_of_NIMH Exhibit B. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Prince_of_Egypt Exhibit C. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spider-Man:_Into_the_Spider-Ve...

Two of those three are over 30 years old and the other is a movie with a $90M budget. I was talking about TV shows.

Though I've heard things like Castlevania are good, haven't seen it though.

Re: Anime is a $25B industry that pays its animators pennies

#203
post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The "if we paid people fairly things would be prohibitively expensive" argument is a terrible one, just to note. First, it rarely seems to actually be the case since the requirement that employees be paid fairly mostly just drives away low-value efforts. It's also an attitude that, if taken to its logical extreme, demands society have an underpaid underclass that suffers so the rest of us can have nice things.

First, there is no such thing as a "fair pay". All of it is driven by demand and supply, always, except when regulations or external factors somehow break things. Second, of course increased costs of production lead to consequences for end users or people who buy the content. We see that all of the time in every industry.

I mean, "minimum wage" is the federal definition of "fair pay". So in that lens it isn't fair.

>Second, of course increased costs of production lead to consequences for end users or people who buy the content. We see that all of the time in every industry.

When possible. The issue is a lot of anime in Japan still relies in broadcast, so it's much harder to increase the cost of entry. Streaming is becoming more popular, but nowhere near as prevalent as the western streaming services.

And physical media... Well, feel free to look up your favorite anime's pricing in Japan. Not only the prices but the fact that they tend to bundle seasonal anime in batches of 2-3 episodes, not an entire seasonal box.

Re: Anime is a $25B industry that pays its animators pennies

#204
I briefly hung out with a manga illustrator while studying in Japan, and what astonished me was how incredibly fast he was at drawing. We went out for hamburgers, and while I was sitting there munching on my burger he made the initial sketch for an entire page.

Re: Anime is a $25B industry that pays its animators pennies

#205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

First, there is no such thing as a "fair pay". All of it is driven by demand and supply, always, except when regulations or external factors somehow break things. Second, of course increased costs of production lead to consequences for end users or people who buy the content. We see that all of the time in every industry.

Businesses do not have an inherent right to exist. If you can't pay a living wage, comply with regulations, and be profitable, your business model is not valid and your business should fail and close. Predictions of dire consequences rarely pan out. Fast food employees in Seattle are earning $15-20/+ per hour and prices did not double - in fact they're not significantly higher than in neighboring counties with lower…

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Re: Anime is a $25B industry that pays its animators pennies

#206
post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Businesses do not have an inherent right to exist. If you can't pay a living wage, comply with regulations, and be profitable, your business model is not valid and your business should fail and close. Predictions of dire consequences rarely pan out. Fast food employees in Seattle are earning $15-20/+ per hour and prices did not double - in fact they're not significantly higher than in neighboring counties with lower…

Employees also do not have a right to any particular career. That's nice that people have a dream to make anime for a living. I hope they get to realize it. But the world does not owe them a particular wage for what they want to do just because it's a job that they want. If you can't make enough money doing a certain job, maybe go get a different job then.

>But the world does not owe them a particular wage for what they want to do just because it's a job that they want

Sure we do, we call it minimum wage. Of course the ceiling is unlimited but there are defined floors.

There are just plenty of loopholes and a lot of off the clock overtime that complicates things. Not just in anime but most of the Japanese workforce. That's a whole other topic to discuss, though.

Re: Anime is a $25B industry that pays its animators pennies

#207

People have free will; market rate is driven by supply, demand and economics of production and revenue. It's similar to people in the US willing to forfeit their financial future to see taylor swift live and the reseller market understanding and exploiting the market dynamics. Are the resellers the problem? or is it inevitable when people value the financial security of the rest of their lives less than seeing taylor…

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If this is true then your comments are literally meaningless, in fact all comments would be.

Re: Anime is a $25B industry that pays its animators pennies

#208
post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

100% would agree.

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no, I just think that minimum wage is the worst possible way to address the issue, from an economic perspective.

It would be far better to pay people what their work is actually worth, and then give them charity through the government, supported by taxes, if need be.

Same goes for healthcare, which should absolutely not be a mandated part of employment. Pay people what they are worth, and let them buy healthcare.

If we want to subsidize or provide charitable healthcare, then we can do so too.

Re: Anime is a $25B industry that pays its animators pennies

#209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

First, there is no such thing as a "fair pay". All of it is driven by demand and supply, always, except when regulations or external factors somehow break things. Second, of course increased costs of production lead to consequences for end users or people who buy the content. We see that all of the time in every industry.

Businesses do not have an inherent right to exist. If you can't pay a living wage, comply with regulations, and be profitable, your business model is not valid and your business should fail and close. Predictions of dire consequences rarely pan out. Fast food employees in Seattle are earning $15-20/+ per hour and prices did not double - in fact they're not significantly higher than in neighboring counties with lower…

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Re: Anime is a $25B industry that pays its animators pennies

#210
post #185
post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Probably the Japanimation upper brass. I don't watch it but most of the characters look identical with the good guys being Japanese but looking like white Americans: large eyes, fair skin, tall, voluptuous. Maybe it's easy to find those animators since their skillset is the same across the board.

Anime characters are cats. https://i.redd.it/i6awe5ngp5cb1.jpg

It's also widely believe that domesticated dogs and cats have been selectively breeded (either on purpose or by accident) to resemble their baby stage, which among mammals it's commonly found as "cute" (big eyes, small nose, etc):

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-017-12582-2

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