Turns out there are some resource management problems even rustc can’t solve.
Some resource management problems are better automated.
The Rust project has a burnout problem
141–150 of 258 posts
Re: The Rust project has a burnout problem
#142Earlier quoted context omitted.
two reasons: 1. writing in lowercase is freeing. it reminds me that grammatical rules are arbitrary, and by extension other rules. "you can just do things." 2. people who are pedantic about this when it's clearly intentional are probably not people i want to interact with anyway, so it's a good anti-asshole filter ( https://siderea.dreamwidth.org/1209794.html )
You're going to get some strong/rude reactions from "the other side," which is unfortunate. FWIW, as a reader I do find it genuinely more difficult to read. Capitalization serves a purpose for me, it's not arbitrary. It more clearly separates each sentence. I have to put in more work to read your thoughts without it. Anyway regardless, the rudeness sucks. Sorry on behalf of others who feel as I do.
this is very kindly written, thank you :)
frankly i don't want a larger audience, i didn't expect this to hit HN. i hadn't thought about it being harder to read for people in the project though, i'll do a poll on whether they find it distracting.
Re: The Rust project has a burnout problem
#143Earlier quoted context omitted.
Personally, I don't think it is natural to sit in the same role for more than a few years. And that's not just the primary tasks of the job -- the same people, the same administration, the same bureaucracy. I do feel that virtually no jobs will allow you to grow as a person and enjoy life. Here, by "job" I mean the traditional kind at a corporation or medium-sized organization. After seven years of working in such or…
> I personally feel that no amount of money is worth spending the best part of your youth doing mostly meaningless things It depends on why you’re doing it. Supporting a family, and contributing money and spare time to your community, are very meaningful. I’m building for in order to do my real job which is being a parent and citizen.
That is true. I agree with it for sure. Just so many jobs don't let you do this. But if you managed to find it, that's great!
Re: The Rust project has a burnout problem
#144Earlier quoted context omitted.
I was thinking something along the lines of people who tend to set unusually high standards for themselves. Rust has something of a self-image of always being best-of-breed in everything it attempts, so I could believe that it might be particularly attractive to those sorts. Other possibilities might be that Rust developers skew younger than average (I don't know whether that's true), or that its six-week release cyc…
> people who tend to set unusually high standards for themselves I would agree, at least I am like that when using Rust (though I don't contribute). And it's true that this is a shortcut to burnout. > or that its six-week release cycle attracts people who think that a year is a long time I don't speak for the Rust project but to me this always sounded like a measure to avoid stagnation. Having six week slices helps r…
From the outside, the Rust project seems to be governed like a government project. Is that markedly better?
Linux shows us at least one way to run a successful long term project. What is their governance model?
Re: The Rust project has a burnout problem
#145Do other people react as strongly as I did to the lack of capitalisation at the start of sentences? The post is generally "well" written with good grammar and punctuation so I find it strange - it feels like a style choice. But the style choice just instinctively makes part of my brain feel like it's written by a child.
If you can't get past the writing style, you're probably not a very successful person given your focus on complete non-essentials.
Re: The Rust project has a burnout problem
#146This is why I think that C++ will be around in the next 50 years but Rust? I can't tell.
Some might think C++ will take years (few years I was hoping 2025, but seems unlikely now) to catch up to Rust in some important ways.
There's nothing to be caught up with. C++ is a different language with different tradeoffs than Rust. I hope it stays that way
Re: The Rust project has a burnout problem
#147Earlier quoted context omitted.
> people who tend to set unusually high standards for themselves I would agree, at least I am like that when using Rust (though I don't contribute). And it's true that this is a shortcut to burnout. > or that its six-week release cycle attracts people who think that a year is a long time I don't speak for the Rust project but to me this always sounded like a measure to avoid stagnation. Having six week slices helps r…
From the outside, the Rust project seems to be governed like a government project. Is that markedly better? Linux shows us at least one way to run a successful long term project. What is their governance model?
Wish I had an answer.
Re: The Rust project has a burnout problem
#148Earlier quoted context omitted.
Unfortunately, people who take ownership and accountability are often the same people that take pride in their work, which means they aren’t emotionally detached. As long as you're emotionally attached to your work, burnout is a real risk whether you get paid or not. Ironically, the solution from my perspective is the opposite of most advice. It’s not for everyone to become drudging zombies apathetic about their work…
> my conclusion was that my burnout (and I think others too) was caused by being a caring decent person in an uncaring world Yikes! That hits way too close to home. You didn't have to attack me like that. In seriousness, this is a very astute and correct observation. Noticed it in myself and several others as well. It really pays off to correct your level of caring with what you see from your superiors and colleagues…
I also see some truth in that insight.
A problem I have is I don't know how to work if I don't care. At my last job I tried to not care and succeeded, but then got fired for poor performance.
Are there sufficiently productive people who don't care? Or does everyone care, but some hold themselves to impossibly high standards?
I don't know how to separate "lower standards" and "stop caring". They are the same to me, because lowering my standards requires not caring about the things that comprise my high standard.
Re: The Rust project has a burnout problem
#149> new contributors make PRs. they make silly simple mistakes due to lack of experience; you point them out and they get fixed Sometimes the right answer is to immediately say "your PR is not up to project standards, it won't be reviewed, please revise it yourself if you want it accepted". It's not a job of a maintainer to educate every wannabe-contributor.
Thinking back to my earliest FLOSS contributions, I don't agree. Up to a point.
Some of the PRs I submitted were pretty dumb and a complete waste of someone's time to review/reject but they showed enough patience to help me get "over the hump" and to eventually get commit access to the repo -- which didn't really help with getting features implemented because I have an apparently unlimited supply of dodgy ideas and would get "why is this needed?" a lot. I also had a habit of getting code to about 80% there before doing a PR "for discussion" knowing full well the lead maintainer would fix up the remaining 20% if it were a valuable enough addition.
Probably also helped that the project has a history of working with GSoC students and the devs were a generally helpful bunch with getting new contributors up to speed on the codebase.
Honestly, if they weren't so welcoming I'd be half the halfassed-coder I am today.
Re: The Rust project has a burnout problem
#150Earlier quoted context omitted.
> my conclusion was that my burnout (and I think others too) was caused by being a caring decent person in an uncaring world Yikes! That hits way too close to home. You didn't have to attack me like that. In seriousness, this is a very astute and correct observation. Noticed it in myself and several others as well. It really pays off to correct your level of caring with what you see from your superiors and colleagues…
I also see some truth in that insight. A problem I have is I don't know how to work if I don't care. At my last job I tried to not care and succeeded, but then got fired for poor performance. Are there sufficiently productive people who don't care? Or does everyone care, but some hold themselves to impossibly high standards? I don't know how to separate "lower standards" and "stop caring". They are the same to me, be…
Oh, that one is easy IMO.
Create a backlog of tasks that you would want to do in a week. Then do it in a month.
Not caring doesn't mean slacking off. It means to reduce your output.