Earlier quoted context omitted.
Extending this thread because it costs maybe max 2 hours of consult time with a lawyer to put one together. $500 today can save you from a $5M lawsuit tomorrow. And even then you should still read it and become intimately knowledgeable with each provision
> $500 today can save you from a $5M lawsuit tomorrow. Yup. I've had one or two clients make all sorts of threats at me, accusing me of stuff when it was caused by their inactions. But then funnily enough, when they finally get round to paying their lawyers to look at the contract they signed, they find they don't have a leg to stand on or at least they'll struggle to make a worthwhile case.
Ask HN: Where can I find good legal documents?
51–60 of 81 posts
Re: Ask HN: Where can I find good legal documents?
#52Earlier quoted context omitted.
Thanks for the mention and kind words! I’m one of the cofounders of Common Paper, happy to answer any questions. Our docs are free, released under creative comments, have been downloaded more than 17,000 times and used to close millions of dollars worth of deals. If you’re not sure what kind of contract you need, this blog post might help: https://commonpaper.com/blog/saas-contracts/
Do you know of any similar resources in the Family Law area? (not sure how to specifically word my question, but helping someone with some custody related issues - and wondering if there is some resource I could be aware of to help?) Else, was going to turn to the GPTs and see what they may muster, but any even general direction pointers would be appreciated?
https://helloprenup.com/ https://hellodivorce.com/ https://www.getdynasty.com/ https://trustandwill.com/
I haven't personally used those services, but the founders are great
Re: Ask HN: Where can I find good legal documents?
#53For those not familiar: Common Paper https://commonpaper.com/standards/ seems to have the best free standard docs. Here's the post where they describe it https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36043944 here's another one: https://www.avodocs.com/
I've saved so much time using CommonPaper at my company. Many agreements are still negotiated, but even the cover-page concept makes it that much easier to understand what is being argued.
Re: Ask HN: Where can I find good legal documents?
#54Re: Ask HN: Where can I find good legal documents?
#55Earlier quoted context omitted.
Thanks for the mention and kind words! I’m one of the cofounders of Common Paper, happy to answer any questions. Our docs are free, released under creative comments, have been downloaded more than 17,000 times and used to close millions of dollars worth of deals. If you’re not sure what kind of contract you need, this blog post might help: https://commonpaper.com/blog/saas-contracts/
Do you know of any similar resources in the Family Law area? (not sure how to specifically word my question, but helping someone with some custody related issues - and wondering if there is some resource I could be aware of to help?) Else, was going to turn to the GPTs and see what they may muster, but any even general direction pointers would be appreciated?
Re: Ask HN: Where can I find good legal documents?
#56And, there's lots of resources and data, like this: https://seedlegals.com/termometer/
Re: Ask HN: Where can I find good legal documents?
#57For those not familiar: Common Paper https://commonpaper.com/standards/ seems to have the best free standard docs. Here's the post where they describe it https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36043944 here's another one: https://www.avodocs.com/
Thanks for the mention and kind words! I’m one of the cofounders of Common Paper, happy to answer any questions. Our docs are free, released under creative comments, have been downloaded more than 17,000 times and used to close millions of dollars worth of deals. If you’re not sure what kind of contract you need, this blog post might help: https://commonpaper.com/blog/saas-contracts/
Re: Ask HN: Where can I find good legal documents?
#58Earlier quoted context omitted.
This isn't necessarily true. I've spent six figures on legal fees easily, and I also use templates and off the shelf stuff all the time. Clerky is a good resource and is fine for most core stuff. You just can't pay lawyers every time you do everything, it's a waste of resources for small simple businesses that may never go anywhere. And the other issues is EVEN IF YOU DO that doesn't guarantee anything, most lawyers…
> it's a waste of resources for small simple businesses that may never go anywhere. As per my original post. That statement is one made from the comfortable armchair of somebody who has not had to litigate off the back of a free/cheap ready-made contract. What is a waste of resources is paying a lawyer to try to get you off the hook for something that could have reasonably been in the contract in the first place had…
People who have actually hired lawyers and litigated things know what a shit show it all is.
> As per my original post. That statement is one made from the comfortable armchair of somebody who has not had to litigate off the back of a free/cheap ready-made contract.
I've done exactly that. You can create a contract by two people writing down what they agree on in bullet points and have it be binding and litigate it if you want instead too. It's actually pretty normal. Legal docs aren't magic, they're words that represent agreement between humans, and in litigation usually what's going on is a bunch of humans trying to figure out which narrative best represents the actual underlying agreement between the people in question.
> What is a waste of resources is paying a lawyer to try to get you off the hook for something that could have reasonably been in the contract in the first place had you had it drafted for your specific business context rather than relying on some shit internet template.
Even more of a waste of resources is paying a lawyer to sort of kind of pay attention for a few minutes to your requests before assuming you're like some other situation he's seen and giving you that person's template and charging you $3,500. Which is generally what happens to people if they don't know what they're doing.
Or, alternately, paying $25,000 for a real firm with domain expertise who do actually listen to you and successfully craft a great customized document that does in fact slightly improve on the template you would have used. And then none of those things ever actually happen and it doesn't end up mattering anyways.
> Yes, lawyers use base templates, but that's because there are some clauses that will always need to be there no matter what. However the devil is in the details and the lawyers also sit down with you to understand your business context and those templates get edited, sometimes heavily edited depending on the business context.
> The point is that you are paying the lawyer for their experience. They know what should be kept in the template. They know what should be removed from the template. They know what should be added to the template AND they know how to add stuff to the templates in a legally correct manner.
Yeah sure, that's possible. But in order to get good legal work you have to know what to ask for, and you have to be working with the right lawyer.
Most people aren't going to be good at either of those two things, and working from templates is quite likely to lead to better outcomes for those people at a tiny fraction of the cost.
Re: Ask HN: Where can I find good legal documents?
#59For those not familiar: Common Paper https://commonpaper.com/standards/ seems to have the best free standard docs. Here's the post where they describe it https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36043944 here's another one: https://www.avodocs.com/
Thanks for the mention and kind words! I’m one of the cofounders of Common Paper, happy to answer any questions. Our docs are free, released under creative comments, have been downloaded more than 17,000 times and used to close millions of dollars worth of deals. If you’re not sure what kind of contract you need, this blog post might help: https://commonpaper.com/blog/saas-contracts/
Re: Ask HN: Where can I find good legal documents?
#60Earlier quoted context omitted.
Thanks for the mention and kind words! I’m one of the cofounders of Common Paper, happy to answer any questions. Our docs are free, released under creative comments, have been downloaded more than 17,000 times and used to close millions of dollars worth of deals. If you’re not sure what kind of contract you need, this blog post might help: https://commonpaper.com/blog/saas-contracts/
I'm about 99% sure calling it "creative comments" is just a brain slip (or TTS error) and you meant "creative commons," but because that really would be a creative change, and the 1% chance that I'm wrong has a really big risk when dealing with a company familiar with legal documents, I just want to confirm?
All of our standard agreements are released under the Creative Commons CC BY 4.0 license. More details on that license here: https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/